posted on February 28, 2005 07:55:31 PM new
I hate these people.... really ... I do. I can deal with impatience... I have even learned to deal with the blatant "this is your last chance" "I've emailed you several times" first time lying emails but illiteracy drives me straight up a wall.
im giving u the chance 2 get back 2 me 4 the last time if i hav'nt herd from u by 2morrow
From now on they all get returned for language clarification.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on February 28, 2005 08:40:52 PM new
Fenix - I would have to agree with you. When I receive an email from someone who uses this type of writing, i.e. (4=for, u=you, oic=oh I see), it makes me think that people have completely forgotten how to communicate with proper grammar and punctuation or they have gotten so lazy that everything has become abbreviated, or maybe it's just because they can't type or spell. I don't know, but it makes me a bit crazy trying to read it sometimes. And it's so easy to use a spell-checker, but seems people just don't bother with that either. Jeezzzz...
~ Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. ~
posted on February 28, 2005 09:29:21 PM new
I agree!
I think there are a lot of people out there who never learned typing skills, hunt and peck people, and they need to use shorthand or a message would take forever. Just guessing, though.
___________________________________
posted on February 28, 2005 10:04:27 PM new
I agree also. Abbreviations, shorthand and codes have their place. When communicating in Morse code, there are several standard abbreviations that greatly speed up a QSO (conversation) and allow people who cannot speak the other's language to communicate with each other. Police departments adopted the 10 code shortly after two way communications were introduced, because it allows more people to communicate in a given amount of time on a single frequency. It's also less subject to errors in marginal conditions than normal vocal communications. But in the case of an email between a buyer and seller, discussing a business transaction, there is absolutely no excuse for using any types of communication that would not be used in a formal business letter.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
LOL! I can't figure out the text messaging on my phone either.
It's not only email where grammar has taken a dive. It's also in the spoken word. "Know what I mean?" I hate that phrase. Especially when it's used repeatedly throughout a conversation. I don't even think some people realize they're doing it. No, I don't know what you mean. Why don't you explain it to me? The use of "me" instead of "I" (Dave, Tom and me went to the store) also grates on my nerves. Hey people, would you say "Me went to the store?" I wonder what they're taught in English class these days!
Incoherent emails, especially when dealing with eBay sales really are enough to drive you crazy.
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
Sometime actually tell someone "no, I don't know". They'll get a glazed over look in their eyes, because they have no idea that they are repeatedly saying "know what I mean?".
posted on March 1, 2005 06:15:26 AM new im giving u the chance 2 get back 2 me 4 the last time if i hav'nt herd from u by 2morrow
"Amused" is the way I feel about it too. A creative and deliberate misuse of grammar and structure is a distinguishing feature of some writers. Now, an attempt to misuse the English language is being made by Ebay buyers? LOL!
Dbl is exceedingly talented in this respect and has the ability to switch back and forth between effective misuse to effective standard use.
posted on March 1, 2005 06:53:20 AM newI am amused by it too.It's the kids doing it mostly. Thats their slang talk. It's all over the internet.
Unfortunately, they are carrying to the classroom, and into life as well. My sister
is an English teacher at a local High School. It's
so sad reading the stuff they write in
preparation for their end of course exams.
My 20 year old step daughter knows of absolutely no other way
to write. I had to explain to her what the "shift" key will capitalize those letters
at the beginning of sentences .
"CAPITALIZE !?!...uhhh, Why!?!" <Whack!>
posted on March 1, 2005 07:08:32 AM new
ajbooks9000: I agree. I would not want to be a teacher in this era. I have always liked to play with words, and every generation has their jive talk. But you're right. These kids can't write or spell properly even if they tried.
Do you know if you go to any of the cell phone's site home pages, they now list the text messaging slang the kids use to hide from their parents? lol!! But they can hardly keep up with it!
Fenix, perhaps it wouldnt be so annoying when the message comes: So how due U wan me to payu that 500 George Washington's?
posted on March 1, 2005 07:33:09 AM new
dblfugger9: lol !
Fenix:
how about:
yl ur w8n 2 rx my nxt Emsg, pls taK a ryTN corZ.
R.S.V.P. wen Uv rcvd a C or btr +l wl B =: ) 2 cmplt dis transaction.
(translation: While you are waiting to receive my next email, please take a writing course. When you have received a C or better, I will be happy to complete
this transaction.)
posted on March 1, 2005 08:37:31 AM new
It's the hip-hop generation and the Rap music they listen to that causes them to talk and write the way they do. They are obviously trying to emulate these Rap idols. People like Snoop Dog, M&M, Ice-T, etc.
posted on March 1, 2005 08:55:27 AM new
Dead-on, Cheryl! And, because many have been taught not to start a sentence with "me and him," they won't ever use it even when it's appropriate.
"The teacher gave a reward to him and me." Totally correct. But I hear even on-air people say "to he and I," "for he and I," etc. As you suggest, they wouldn't say "to I" or "for he." Putting the "and" in there just glitches it out. I'm an old English teacher (can you tell?). ~Adele
___________________________________
posted on March 1, 2005 09:51:30 AM new
And yet, posters elsewhere on Vendio, who don't intentionally write like this, take great exception to having their spelling or grammar corrected. What gives?
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
posted on March 1, 2005 10:55:08 AM new
Besides IM, give thanks to our education system. Here is the latest that drives me nuts - Feel good spelling. If your child can't spell the word properly, don't worry - Spell it like you want, and it is ok. They will work on it later. Well, do you really think they are going to get around to it.
Don't fret though, we do need those who are willing to work at minimum wage for this society to thrive, so there is a place for them. Just be careful when dealing with them. Here is something that happened yesterday:
I pay for something at a store. They have a discount card where any purchase over $15 is discounted by 5% - I give the card, clerk scans it, but he does not press the right button, and then goes to charge me full price. I point out it did not take the discount, and he tells me that the purchase is not $15 (It came to $16.85) - I then ask him if he is going to give me more than $5 change, and he says no (I gave him a $20) - I said then the amount is over $15. He had to call a supervisor to verify. Finally, they agreed indeed the amount was over $15. Then he ran the discount, now I owe $16.01 - He gave me $3, and change, but this moron literally could NOT count out change to reach 99 cents. It was amazing, an example of what we can expect more of. He kept throwing small coins down, I kept a running count, it took him about 4 minutes to give change.
posted on March 1, 2005 01:05:05 PM new
ebayvet, I wonder if the discount is only on purchases of 15 or more. In other words if its the tax that bumps it up or over 15.00, the card doesnt work?... But never mind, you said the total was 16.85 and I'm sure you dont have more than a 10% sales tax. Some places here we have almost 11% (5.5 county and 5% state)
I've run accross the same thing with counting change btw. Just today, I had to count out five dollars in change and the clerk stood and watched me, (mostly quarters, too) but then he had to recount the whole thing. I dont think these kids are very good with keeping a count with their eyes and in their heads. ...Computer generation.
..
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Mar 1, 2005 01:18 PM ]
English was my favorite subject. My children use the words "me" and "I" correctly. I taught them how to break the sentences down. He and I went to the store. Who went to the store? I did. Not me did. He took me and him. Who did he take? Me. Not I. That's how I was taught. Simple and basic. I don't know what they're being taught now. I suppose it starts at home.
We had slang growing up and it drove my parents crazy. I don't think it was as bad then, though. Although the word "cool" was definitely over-used! I still catch myself sometimes. We also didn't have spell check or the use of calculators during math. Everything was done the old fashioned way and I'm glad it was.
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
posted on March 1, 2005 01:29:11 PM newere is the latest that drives me nuts - Feel good spelling
Nonsense. What schools are using that method? Details please, more than just a classroom you heard about somewhere.
While spelling is probably the one subject taught in schools that has the least to do with intelligence, it's the single most important one to keep you from looking like a doofus later in life. Educators know this and concentrate incessantly on spelling. Unfortunately, they go about it without much information about how good spellers actually spell. Good spellers spell visually, poor spellers spell phonetically. Most spelling programs are phonetic systems, and don't work very well.
This IM talk is different. It's a subculture. What gripes me is the idiots who think that everybody on line is 14 years old. If I were fenix, I'd reply asking the sender if he was old enough to write a check or pay with a credit card.
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
posted on March 1, 2005 01:33:04 PM new
dblfugger9 - No sales tax here in Oregon, so that wasn't it...just plain old stupidity on the part of the clerk, and he proved it when he could not count change back to 99 cents.
posted on March 1, 2005 01:34:59 PM newI don't know what they're being taught now. I suppose it starts at home.
They're being taught the very same thing, Cheryl. The difference is, it isn't being reinforced at home. I grew up in a bilinual home, and I was constantly corrected in two languages. If I hadn't been, I would have figured that kind of talk was just for school, and it wouldn't have been as important. My family validated what I was being taught, and in so doing, helped make it important to me.
No teacher can teach anyone anything they don't want to learn.
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
You are right. I remember my mother correcting me all the time. It stuck. I did it with my children and my daughter is doing it with hers.
All you have to do is read some of the descriptions written on eBay. They're awful. I particularly liked the time I saw the word "necklace" spelled "neklice". That made me want to bid on it!
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
posted on March 1, 2005 01:41:25 PM new
Prof: I agree with much of what you say about how good spellers learn to spell. As a teacher of high-IQ 8th and 9th graders, I emphasized to them that they would never be good writers or spellers unless they were good READERS. Reading teaches us how a word should look, and it teaches the rhythm of language as well as increasing their vocabulary. I am convinced you have to be a reader (voracious at times as a child) to have these skills.
I never worried about the students who were hiding a novel behind a textbook. I believed that anything that student wanted to learn in his life, he'd know how to use books.
I'm afraid we've raised a couple of TV generations that aren't the readers many of us were as young people.
_____
[ edited by Roadsmith on Mar 1, 2005 01:42 PM ]
You will be happy to know that my granddaughter is an avid reader even at age 6. She has a virtual library in her room! When the children attend Saturday family days, the school allows them to pick out a book to take home and keep.
On Thursday, a film crew came to her school. They're doing a movie on reading. Tiffany was in it reading aloud because she does so well. She's been reading since before kindergarten.
Ah, just like her grandmother! Smart.
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
posted on March 1, 2005 03:24:07 PM new SAT graded with a focus on content...
The panel overlooks a few grammatical errors and misspelled words. "F. Scott Fitzgerald once handed in a manuscript with seven consecutive misspelled words," Bremen says. "If you can write like F. Scott Fitzgerald, you will be okay."
This is not like grading a school essay, in which points may be deducted for uncapitalized letters or an insufficient number of paragraphs. The scoring technique puts a premium on a student's ability to develop a logical chain of reasoning over the mechanics of writing.
.