posted on October 16, 2001 05:33:34 PM new
Sometime back, I saw a news segment about a Reverend somewhere down South, who advocates people to "literally beat the devil" out of children. Three children were removed from their parents' home because of severe abuse, while several others ended in the hospital with various injuries, including broken teeth and bones.
Well, today, a Reverend Allen (?), was a guest on a show called ) "Talk or Walk". Perhaps some of you saw it: WB20 in Northern California, at 12 noon.
12:00 p.m. Talk or Walk
Debating spanking ; man demands his wife lose weight; couple stay together for the children. {CC, Stereo}
Parental guidance rating: TVPG
Anyway, the host asked the Reverend, a blak gentleman, if there was a difference between a "spanking" and a "beating", to which the Reverend replied that, yes, there was.
The host then asked the Reverend to demonstrate what a "spanking" would consist of, and had a dummy, tall doll representing a 5 or so-year-old child, brought on stage. The Reverend took off his belt, wrapped it around his hand, made a fist, and proceeded to hit the doll on the buttocks and thighs, while talking to it: "So, you still won't listen?", and delt another volley of blows on the doll, but even more violent than the first.
A woman had to leave the audience, as she could not stand to watch this crualty, coming from a man of the cloth...People's faces in the audience, displayed total disbelief! And I stood there with my mouth open!...
Photos were then brought out, showing a portion of a 14-year-old teen boy's backside, with deep, bleeding cuts on his buttoks, from severe beating.
The man keeps dodging the charges and the police...on the basis of hif faith and beliefs...
posted on October 16, 2001 06:01:11 PM new
Give it 5 or 6 years and the reverand will open his door one day and the skinny 14 year old will be 19 and standing there with an axe handle..........
posted on October 16, 2001 06:16:17 PM newplsmith...That's awful!...
gravid..Yes...deep sigh...That would definitely leave more than bodily scars!
I am so sick of fanatics, doing these terrible things in the name of their faith...And I am just as disturbed by the Ultra Orthodox Jews in Jerusalem, throwing feces, among other things, at women who dare dessecrate the Wailing Wall by praying there, instead of staying home and having twenty babies...
What a sick world!
posted on October 16, 2001 06:31:38 PM new
Well Shosh, I'm sorry for the graphic images, but I wanted to make the point that one of the reasons many Americans feel we're justified in toppling the Taliban over ( -- abuse of women and their impoverished children -- ) is one we condone in our own country -- and it's being done in the name of religion here, too, though not exclusively. Some men just like to beat women and children. The ones who can hide behind God to do it -- well, there are no words for them...
Again, my apologies if the link upset you. I know these are wrenching times...
posted on October 16, 2001 06:48:06 PM new
plsmith, seeing stuff like that pisses me off so much, I see red. I know that not all women are like me, but any man raises a club to me better sleep lightly, or kill me where I dont get up after he beats me. Those poor women over there have no chance. And the ones here who get the same from men, I hope they DO have a chance. Seeing that kind of thing does the same thing to me as seeing animal abuse. Makes me crazy mad.
posted on October 16, 2001 06:50:51 PM new
I agree, Shoshanah, it is disgusting. My opinion on this is that ANYONE who hits someone smaller than they are is a snivelling coward. I hope Gravid's prediction of the future comes true for this puke. And the fact that this moron get air time is a travesty.
Aaaaaaaargh, can you tell this subject just pisses me off? LOL
That's tragic! And it's happening in the United States of America and in the name of religion. The atrocities that we percieve in the Taliban are going on all over the world. Taliban violence against those who break the rules just mirrors what happens in the modern world. We have capital punishment, wife beating and child abuse here too.
Hindus who demolished the Babri Masjid and have their eyes on a number of other masajid throughout India, ultra-orthodox Jews who throw stones at women who walk through their neighbourhoods wearing pants or short sleeves, all have more in common with the Taliban than they realise.
The Southern Baptist Religion has some similarity to the Taliban. I had a Sunday School teacher who told the class that we would go to hell if we danced and listened to popular music. Does that sound familiar?
posted on October 16, 2001 07:16:19 PM new
Southern Baptists told me my dad went to hell because he owned a bar.
Uh Oh. My monitor was a lovely shade of pink because I calmed down,but now its turning red again. Hell, the whole room is red. Bad sign. "danger will robinson, danger".
posted on October 16, 2001 07:50:12 PM new
{{{Shosh}}}, how sad. Especially going through what we're all going through, you'd think people would be thanking God we're still here instead of beating children. What I always wonder in these "religious" groups, is how come they tend to make negative interpretations instead of the obvious positive intended?
I agree with you hepburn. I think the one thing that would make me snap would be seeing someone hurt a child or animal.
posted on October 16, 2001 08:02:00 PM new
Helen, your comment about Baptists is the most unbelievable and unfounded accusation that I have read here so far. Total garbage.
BTW, I am wondering at what point AW will equate "taliban" with "nazi".
posted on October 16, 2001 08:18:40 PM new
Only a onesided view is ever presented.
1 Peter 3:6-8 You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered.
Colossians 3:18-20 Husbands, love your wives and do not be embittered against them.
Ephesians 5:27-29 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He
who loves his own wife loves himself;
Ephesians 5:24-26 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave
Himself up for her,
Ephesians 5:21-23 Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord.
But I believe that this thread is about child beating so back to the topic.
I said, "The Southern Baptist Religion has some similarity to the Taliban. I had a Sunday School teacher who told the class that we would go to hell if we danced and listened to popular music. Does that sound familiar?"
I attended a church on West Capital Street in Jackson, Mississippi. That is
exactly...word for word what I was told. In fact, I worried about it for several weeks and had nightmares.
Of course, as I grew up, I learned that this was, as you say "garbage." In fact, I now consider everything that they believe, "garbage."
posted on October 16, 2001 08:32:49 PM newplsmith....I want you to know that in no way was I blaming you for showing those pictures! You are a very dear person, and I would not mis-interprete your intentions. So sorry if I gave that impression...
You see, that was exactly my point also: that all fundamentalist groups hide behind the hypocritical façade to perpetrate terrible crimes: the Taliban against women, the Ultra Orthodox Jews against women and ANY Jew of a different denomination (We have Ultra Orthodox, Modern Orthodox, Conservative, Reform and Reconstructionist), and obviously this demon of a supposedly Reverend right here, in our the Southern States, commits his crimes against CHILDREN for gosh'sake!
jt: please, stop taking EVERY COMMENT so dam personally! If you are a Southern Baptist, fine....Whatever you are, FINE..No one said that YOU are doing any wrong...You want to cloak yourself in a veil of denial, FINE also. But that so-called Reverend is no more than a cultist.
You demand the right to preach and post your links; we too, have rights to express our opinion.
Thank you.
posted on October 16, 2001 08:34:39 PM new
Terri, just because Helen said Southern Baptists, dont take offense that she meant ALL southern baptists. After all, the people make the church, do they not? SOuthern Baptists said my dad was in hell. Wrong thing to say to me. But that doesnt mean ALL southern baptists would say such a thing. Just that one church did..or rather, not the church itself...the PASTOR said it and he REPRESENTED that particular church.
Then again, maybe Helen did mean it another way. I cant speak for her. But for myself, I will always see Southern Baptists in a different light, just because of what that moron said to me about my dad. That doesnt mean I will shun them...but I will be wary, ya know?
posted on October 16, 2001 08:37:46 PM new
Shosh - I wish I had seen that show. I had read about him and the parents some where. Did they mention that when the children were taken from the parents the parents refused parenting classes to get them back? They said that they were good parents and didn't need classes. Really sick.
A while ago in RT I mentioned the things I saw when I worked with abused women, especially the women from the Middle Eastern countries. Donny attacked me and told me I was the who needed help. I'm glad you are all bringing it up again. It really needs to be brought out in the open.
Jay Leno's wife has been appearing on many shows and talking about this. She's really done a terrific job.
posted on October 16, 2001 08:37:58 PM newjt:Only a onesided view is ever presented.
The trouble with the Bible quotations you provided (& with the Southern Baptist constitution) is that while the man is told to love his wife, the wife is told to [/i]submit[/i] to her husband. "Love" and "submission" are not the same--nor equal.
What is hysterical about the Southern Baptist Constitution is that it says The husband and wife are of equal worth before God, since both are created in God's image. The marriage relationship models the way God relates to His people.
Equal? Really? I don't think so, not when it goes on to say the wife is to "submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband"--heck, *they* don't even bother to say he should love her! They say that the wife is equal *again*--then say that she has the "God-given responsibility" to serve as his helper "managing the household and nurturing the next generation" (a fancy way of saying barefoot, pregnant & in the kitchen where she belongs).
