posted on February 21, 2003 10:11:59 PM new
Well, our troops will now be taking an active part in the fighting in the Philippines. Those of us that said Iraq wouldn't be Bush's only or last stop were right.
Philippines-U.S. Troops Deal Hits Block U.S. Deployment of Antiterror Troops in Philippines Faces Political Challenges
"MANILA, Philippines Feb. 21 —
Philippine leaders battled Friday to quell growing political turmoil triggered by Washington's disclosure that hundreds of U.S. special operations troops are on the way to fight alongside the Philippine military against ruthless Abu Sayyaf rebels.
Unlike previous arrangements in which U.S. troops played advisory roles out of the line of fire, American troops this time will join Philippine soldiers in direct combat on southern Jolo island, U.S. defense officials said.
Another 1,000 U.S. Marines will be stationed off the coast of the jungle island, ready to provide military and logistical support in the campaign against the al-Qaida-linked terror group."
posted on February 21, 2003 10:27:08 PM new
We've been oveer there at least since just after 9-11. However, our role to date has been purely as an advisory role. THat's why this is newsworty -- it's an escalation in participation.
My guess is that if Bush invades iraq, Kim Ill Yung will unleash his hordes into South Korea at the same time. With anti-American sentiment so high over there right now, we would be trying to fight a war for those who didn't want us there (sound familiar?)
posted on February 21, 2003 10:46:34 PM new
Vietnam started in just the same way. We started as advisors, then went on to combatant status. Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on February 21, 2003 11:50:51 PM new
There are new news reports on Iran and Weapons of Mass Destruction, namely Nukes. I guess Bush already is looking towards the next set of dominoes to fall.
posted on February 22, 2003 12:24:47 AM new
The difference between Vietnam and the Phillipines is that it was once our territory and the majority of the people there actually want a US presence. The Government are the ones that asked us to leave, because they wanted to show some idependence.
We have always looked out for the Phillipines since 1898...
posted on February 22, 2003 03:05:35 AM new
Um...you might want to read a little history before you boast about how our country "has looked after the Philippines since 1898."
After the Spanish-American war--which was engineered by Hearst's yellow press & happened to coincide with a revolution for independence by the Philippine citizens--the American forces refused to let the Filipino revoltionary leaders into the capital.
Our country then went on to demand, as part of the Peace Treaty with Spain, that the Philippines be ceded to us. By February 1899, it was ours.
And that was the start of the Philippine-American war, which our history texts contrive never to mention to us. It took us two years to break the back of the Filipino resistance, and during that time some our troops took part in some atrocities, including the so-called "water cure." The water cure involved forcing someone's mouth open, & pouring gallons of water down the throat. The stomach would swell, making breathing impossible--a soldier would then jump or push on the victim's stomach, forcibly expelling the water. This was repeated until desired info was obtained or the victim died.
Once we were in control, though our government claimed to be preparing the Philippines for independence, we dragged our feet & they didn't get it until 1935. And even then we maintained a strong military presence.
Now, we did do a lot for them during World War II--but then, they did a lot for *us.* In return, after the war we demanded & got a 99 year lease on military bases there (later shortened, then ended in the 70's). We also, under the guise of "forgiving" their war debt forced an amendment to their constituion that gave US citizens equal standing with Filipinos in the exploitation of natural resources there.
So you see, we have in fact been "looking after ourselves" in the Philippines.
edited for UBB
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
[ edited by bunnicula on Feb 22, 2003 03:06 AM ]
posted on February 22, 2003 04:02:41 AM new
And you know, thinking on the Spanish-American war, it's funny how much its beginnings resemble what we have going on now.
See Spain owned Cuba at that time. Cubans were struggling for freedom & Spain was being *extremely* repressive towards them over it. Newspapers here in the US highlighted this brutal repression & public sentiment began to run high here that "something should be done." Of course, the little fact that we'd coveted Cuba for about 100 years had a little something to do with our eagerness to get the Spanish out. In 1896, President Cleveland tells Spain to resolve its problems in Cuba, or the US might take action. Our government sent a warship, the Maine, to protect US citizens in the area. When the Maine explodes, the yellow press in the US loudly proclaim that the Spanish did it. There's no proff that that was so, but still...
In March of 1898, U.S. Senator Redfield Proctor (R-Vt.) influences Congress and U.S. business community in favor of war with Spain. later that month, our government issued an ultimatum to the Spanish Government to terminate its presence in Cuba. Spain hadn't accepted that ultimatum in its reply of April 1, 1898.
On April 4, the New York Journal issued a million copy press run dedicated to the war in Cuba & calling for the immediate U.S. entry into war with Spain.
On April 10, Spanish Governor General Blanco in Cuba suspended hostilities in the war in Cuba.
Despite that, on April 11 President McKinley requested authorization from the U.S. Congress to intervene in Cuba, with the object of putting an end to the war between Cuban revolutionaries and Spain.
On April 13, Congress agreed to President McKinley's request for intervention in Cuba, but without recognition of the Cuban Government.
The Spanish government declared that the sovereignity of Spain was jeopardized by U.S. policy and prepared a special budget for war expenses.
On April 20, President McKinley signed the Joint Resolution for war with Spain and the ultimatum was forwarded to Spain. The Spanish Government considered the Joint Resolution of April 20 a declaration of war, and war was formally declared between us on April 25. Portugal declared itself neutral.
On May 4, a joint resolution for the annexation of Hawaii was introduced into the U.S. House of Representatives, & supported by McKinley
On May 10, the captain of the U.S.S. Charleston was ordered to capture Guam on the way to Manila.
Between June & October, U.S. businesses and the government were united around a policy of retaining all or part of the Philippines after the hostilities were over.
By the time the war finally ended in 1902, more than 4,200 U.S. soldiers, 20,000 Filipino soldiers, and 200,000 Filipino civilians were dead.
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on February 22, 2003 07:35:02 AM new
On the contrary I stand by my words, the Philippine people did not want the bases closed ( That was in the 90's) and our Military gone... however the government did, so we left.
Yes we did stay and fight rebels in the Philippines, yes we did make them a territory ( they received their independence in 1946)
Yes they did prosper as a result of our being there.
MacAurthur said it best.."They are like my children..."
posted on February 22, 2003 12:34:35 PM new
Thank you, Bunnicula, for those two very interesting posts. I was unaware of the full extent of our take-over of the Philippines. What I am aware of is that many of the Philippine people DO look forward to having the Americans back. But you have to understand just why that is. Like Central America, the resources and farmable land on the islands have been owned by a few local families and by American corporations. The rest of the populous lives in absolute squalor and poverty. When I was in the Navy in the late 1970's, a sailor could trade a Zippo lighter with a prostitute for a week's service that included food, a place to sleep, and all of the sex that the guy wanted. A mere $5.00 could hire you an assassin, I was told.
Life is so cheap there and the population so overly exploited, the one and only place where the locals have any opportunity is in the United States Navy. There, they were always relegated to cooking and to be personal Chefs for the higher-ups. After twenty or thirty years of service and saving up their money, they returned home to start a business and received both medical benefits and a federal retirement check. They could also receive Social Security as well. That is why we are wanted there now, because of this little ray of hope.
Also, when the ships came in, it meant that by selling their bodies to the sailors or military personnel, they could afford to eat for one more day. With our military gone, all of that hope was gone as well. Now they just die.
Of course, the wealthy families couldn't care less as they rule the islands and the American corporations keep silent as well.
