posted on July 28, 2003 12:58:23 PM new
NEW YORK (AP) -- New York City is creating the nation's first public high school for gays, bisexuals and transgender students.
The Harvey Milk High School will enroll about 100 students and open in a newly renovated building in the fall. It is named after San Francisco's first openly gay city supervisor, who was assassinated in 1978.
"I think everybody feels that it's a good idea because some of the kids who are gays and lesbians have been constantly harassed and beaten in other schools," Mayor Michael Bloomberg said Monday. "It lets them get an education without having to worry."
The school is an expansion of a two-classroom public school program that began in 1984. A gay-rights youth advocacy group, the Hetrick-Martin Institute, has managed and financed the program since its inception.
The new school's principal, William Salzman, said the school will be academically challenging and will follow mandatory English and math programs. It also will specialize in computer technology, arts and culinary arts.
State Conservative Party Chairman Mike Long criticized the creation of the school.
"Is there a different way to teach homosexuals? Is there gay math? This is wrong," Long said. "There's no reason these children should be treated separately."
The Hetrick-Martin Institute's Web site says the school will give its students "an opportunity to obtain a secondary education in a safe and supportive environment. ... We believe that success requires the ability to respect and value the diverse human community."
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If it's really Common Sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on July 28, 2003 02:32:34 PM new
just curious, why not? If these kids are attending any other school, and they are, you're paying for it, so what's the diff?
___________________________________
What luck for the leaders that men do not think. - Adolph Hitler
NEW YORK — The city is opening a full-fledged high school for gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender students -- the first of its kind in the nation, The Post has learned.
Operating for two decades as a small alternative program with just two classrooms, the new Harvey Milk High School officially opens as a stand-alone public school with 100 students in September.
The school is undergoing a $3.2 million in city-funded renovations approved by the old Board of Education in June of last year. It will eventually take in 170 students by September 2004, more than tripling last year's enrollment.
The Hetrick-Martin Institute -- the gay-rights youth-advocacy group that manages and helps finance the school in conjunction with New York's Department of Education -- has hired the school's first principal.
In the past, Harvey Milk High School -- named after the slain gay San Francisco politician -- was assigned an "off-site" supervisor who also oversaw several other schools.
Principal William Salzman said Harvey Milk will be an academically rigorous school that will specialize in computer technology, arts and a culinary program.
"This school will be a model for the country and possibly the world," Salzman said.
"This is a not a touchy-feely situation. We intend to have 95 percent of our students go on to college. We have a lot of talent coming into the school. We want to steer these kids in the right direction."
But New York State Conservative Party Chairman Mike Long blasted the school as "social engineering" that wastes tax dollars.
"Is there a different way to teach homosexuals? Is there gay math? This is wrong. This makes absolutely no sense," Long said. "There's no reason these children should be treated separately."
Long said there are city and state discrimination laws on the books and that authorities should enforce them to stop gay-bashing.
"What next? Maybe we should have schools for chubby kids who get picked on. Maybe all kids who wear glasses should have special schools. It's ridiculous," he said.
What burns Long most is the $3 million spent on renovations. "Maybe this is one of the reasons the city has no money," he said.
Arthur Larsen, who graduated from the program last month as valedictorian, is thrilled with its expansion into a full-fledged school. "I'm now an alumnus of a real school!" he said. "There's going to be more students. In four years, I want to work here."
I agree with Mike Long - I think it's ridiculous.
"Be kind. Remember everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." - Harry Thompson
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it." - A Few Good Men
posted on July 28, 2003 02:50:42 PM new
In Canada, we have English speaking schools and French speaking schools - you can go to either. It's about choice, not segregation.
posted on July 28, 2003 03:20:26 PM new
I'm actually conflicted on the situation.
From an educational standpoint I think it's a great thing. High school is a pain in the ass under the best of situations. Harrassment and social stresses certainly don't help the educational process so from that stand point I think it is a great thing.
On the flip side, high school is where you build a lot of your social interaction skills. Isoloating GLTGs only serves to delay exposure to the day to day realities of dealing with the predjudices of others and building bigger rifts. It also denies the straight youth an opportunity to be with and interact on a daily basis with GLTDs and come to the realization that sexual preference does not determine worthiness of an individual.
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If it's really Common Sense, why do so few people actually have it?
It would be better if we could teach our children tolerance and respect for other people's choices. But right now, gays, bisexuals and trans-gender students are harassed and endangered at school. And, since most social activities such as school dances, parties and clubs are geared toward heterosexuals, those students who are not heterosexual feel isolated and excluded. To let this situation continue is wrong when we have the opportunity to provide a supportive learning environment for everyone.
posted on July 28, 2003 04:32:50 PM new
Great... now we can pay for the deviants going to their own school... where is Dr. Laura to help straighten them out...
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
[ edited by Twelvepole on Jul 28, 2003 04:50 PM ]
Parents: White Teacher Should Not Teach Black History
OBERLIN, Ohio, Updated 1:33 p.m. EDT July 28, 2003 -- A group of parents said they will fight a possible decision to allow a white teacher to lead classes in black history at Oberlin High School.
NewsChannel5 reported that a scheduling conflict could cause the district to reassign the black teacher who has taught the course for seven years.
Using a white teacher at Oberlin High School would send the wrong message to black students, said A.G. Miller, an associate professor of American and African religious history at Oberlin College.
"The message is that we are not concerned about the importance of your historical background ... that that is less important than a schedule conflict," said Miller, whose three children graduated from Oberlin High School.
Jaqui Willis, a black Oberlin parent, said the teacher is a role model and that removing him from the class would be detrimental to students.
The parents have protested the move to the school board, but the district's superintendent, Beverly Reep, has not commented on the case. Reep told parents at a school board meeting that scheduling issues would be addressed this week.
Schools and community leaders in the Cleveland area are split over the issue of whether blacks should be the only ones to teach black history.
In Cleveland, white and black teachers teach black history. A black teacher teaches black history at Shaker Heights High School, but a white teacher handles classes on oppression and human relations, both which deal extensively with race relations and slavery.
Little research has been done to determine whether same-race teachers lead to higher achievement by minority students. Ronald Ehrenberg, director of Cornell University's Higher Education Research Institute, said many researchers steer clear of the topic out of fear of being attacked.
Michael Williams, interim director of Cleveland State University's black studies program, said schools should choose a black teacher if that person is most qualified, not just because the teacher happens to be black.
If two teachers are equally qualified, Williams gives the edge to the black teacher.
"That person still has the advantage of the culture," said Williams, who is black. "They understand the nuances of the culture."
Phyllis Yarber Hogan, a member of the Oberlin Black Alliance for Progress, said a white teacher wouldn't be well-suited to teaching students about subjects like slavery.
"When you talk about slavery, students need to understand it is not our fault," she said. "Our ancestors did nothing wrong to be enslaved.
"How do you work through that when the person teaching it is the same type of person who did the enslaving?"
grammatical edit
"Be kind. Remember everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." - Harry Thompson
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it." - A Few Good Men
[ edited by wgm on Jul 28, 2003 05:11 PM ]
posted on July 28, 2003 05:41:51 PM new
Interesting concept. The NY Public School system has long had a more unique makeup than many. I went to Brooklyn Tech in the mid 60's at that time it was considered to be one of the elite schools in NY. Included in that group were Music & Art, Bronx HS of Science, Stuyvesant, and Fashion. In the 8th grade citywide testing was done and the top percentile were admitted to these particular schools based on score and recommendations and application (it was optional). College acceptance at that time from this group of scholls was in the high 90 percents. The system tended to dumb down the local schools. Tech was 100% male at that time it has since become co-ed.
The only possible reason I can see for admitting these students to a separate school is if it is impossible to insure their safety in the city school system and that is a sad commentary on the state of our society. I would hope this was a last resort and am more in line wity Helen's opinion on this one.
posted on July 28, 2003 06:25:04 PM new
Perhaps they could seperate the nerds and intellectuals from the great unwashed mass that worship at the alter of football.
And only have Spanish people teach Spanish (not even Mexicans - pure Castillos)
Asian history should only be taught by Orientals and Europeans only teach Western History. After all how could a Black explain the Oriental cultures or the Oriental explain the fine points of European thinking.
In fact early American History should not be taught without hearing at least 50% of the lessons from Native Americans. And the invaders side should only be taught by members of Revolutionary Societies such as Daughters of the American Revolution.
Thanksgiving should only be explained by certified Pilgrims.
posted on July 28, 2003 08:31:24 PM new
I'm ambivalent about the gay school, I'd like to know the real justification for it. If it's a safety issue, I might be for it. Regarding the white teacher teaching black history, how 'bout we get a black teacher to teach pre-civil war history to balance it out? I don't think it's so much an issue of the teacher's color as it is the current black teacher is being REPLACED by someone who is not black. Looks bad, that's all.....
___________________________________
What luck for the leaders that men do not think. - Adolph Hitler
If the issue is education, who cares how anyone gets schooled? Sometimes these new-fangled ways of teaching produce top notch people. Aren't they worth it?
posted on July 28, 2003 09:29:26 PM newSometimes these new-fangled ways of teaching produce top notch people
You're right Kraft, often times they do, but often times they don't.That doesn't mean they shouldn't be tried. As a teacher, my reservations about this case are simple. Calling attention to personal attributes of students, other than academic excellence or other abilities, is probably ill advised. As I said, if the motivation is safety, or creating an atmosphere where these students can excel without fear of ridicule, it's probably a good idea, but if I were a taxpayer in that district I'd want to see some pretty compelling numbers to justify it. If, for example, there is evidence that these students are at increased failure risk due to higher drop out rates because of harassment or violence, then they would qualify as students with special needs, and a facility like this would be justified in my opinion. If on the other hand this is just some kind of new-agey type thing that cannot be justified academically, as a taxpayer in the district I'd be opposed to it. For me, it would have strictly to do with their academic success, and nothing to do with their sexual orientation.
___________________________________
What luck for the leaders that men do not think. - Adolph Hitler
posted on July 29, 2003 12:39:13 AM new
You have answered your own question there Profe, it has nothing to do with acdemic success, it is all about be deviants and another way of making them feel "special".
posted on July 29, 2003 04:44:03 PM new
It's funny. The neocons are all about "school choice" - including the right to use taxpayer money on private schools - as long as the parents are "choosing" religious schools or private for-profit academies run by the families and friends of the GOP elite. But give them any other kind of choice and suddenly the Bushyheads are up in arms. Curious ....
------------------- We do not see things as they are. We see them as we are.
------------The Talmud
posted on July 29, 2003 05:33:38 PM new
I could care less if some deviants started a PRIVATE school with their own funds... misincognito if you had bothered to read the entire first post you would noticed the word PUBLIC. Hell it is even in the title... that means using my money...
NEW York City has announced plans to pour millions of dollars into the United States’
first publicly run high school exclusively for gay, lesbian and trans-gender students - despite
sweeping cuts elsewhere in its education budget.
Plans to earmark £2 million for renovating what will become the school’s premises
in Manhattan’s East Village, have come in for trenchant criticism from conservative
groups and some parents.
Harvey Milk High School, named after the gay San Francisco politician who was
murdered in 1978, has been operating for two decades in a tiny two-room office.
But from September, it will open as a public school with 100 students. It is expected
to double in size by 2005.
Debra Smock, the school administrator, said: "I’m extremely excited. It’s been a
long process. The fact is that more at-risk youth will have the opportunity to receive
a valuable education in a safe and supportive environment."
However, the use of tax money to fund a school which will cater for a tiny minority
of the city’s 1.1 million pupils has caused a surge of protest.
Mike Long, the chairman of the state Conservative Party, described the school as
"social engineering" that wastes tax dollars.
"Is there a different way to teach homosexuals? Is there gay maths? This is wrong.
This makes absolutely no sense," Mr Long told the New York Post. "There’s no
reason these children should be treated separately. What next? Maybe we should
have schools for chubby kids who get picked on. Maybe all kids who wear glasses
should have special schools. It’s ridiculous."
But New York’s mayor, Michael Bloomberg, believes the institution is necessary
in the light of recent "gay-bashing" incidents at city schools.
"It lets [gay and lesbian students] get an education without having to worry. It
solves a discipline problem," he said.
William Salzman, a former Wall Street executive who is the head teacher for the
new school, believes it could lead to similar institutions emerging across the world.
"The school will be a model for the country and possibly the world," he said in a
recent interview at the facility, which will have a new science laboratory, additional
classrooms and a new cafeteria.
The school will offer specialism in computer technology, arts and cookery, but Mr
Salzman insisted it will stick most rigorously to mandatory English and maths education
. "This is not a touchy-feely situation," he said. "We intend to have 95 per cent of our
students go on to college. We want to steer these kids in the right direction."
But New York’s education system recently saw its budget cut by £544 million and
many parents are unhappy at plans for the new school.
"It’s too much," said Patricia Kelly, 45, a mother of three. "They are reducing education
for all the children in the city while handing out huge amounts of cash to what is really
just a thousandth of the population."
posted on July 30, 2003 08:31:18 AM new
Replay - I am willing to bet that you were aware of your sexual preference long before your first sexual experience. Remember, you don't have to have had sex to be gay.
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If it's really Common Sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on July 30, 2003 08:47:04 AM newtwelvepole, What we're talking about here is tax dollars spent on education. (By the way, the Harvey Milk Institute is only nominally inside the NYC public school system - it's actually operated and largely funded by a private not-for-profit corporation.) As far as I can see, it's operating essentially like a charter school.
The big neocon criticism of public schools is that they're not being held accountable for the money that's spent on them and that parents should have a "choice" - and be able to use tax money to pay for it (aka charter schools and vouchers.) Parents who want an option that fits in with the GOP agenda are entitled to have their children educated - at taxpayers' expense. That's why they are getting, and using, public-school vouchers at religious schools. But children who don't fit their rigid little criteria don't.
Personally, I don't think it's a good idea to segregate GLBT students. But clearly, there's a demand among parents for this kind of school. The Harvey Milk Institute has been operating (as a part of the NYC public-school system) since 1984, and there's a waiting list to get in, which is why the expansion was seen as justified by NYC officials.
-------------------
We do not see things as they are. We see them as we are.
------------The Talmud
[ edited by msincognito on Jul 30, 2003 08:49 AM ]
posted on July 31, 2003 07:48:23 AM new
Why, then, should parents be allowed to take tax money away from public schools in the form of vouchers and charter schools?
If everyone's going to be treated the same, then all the kids stay in the public school that serves their residential zone OR go to private school with their parents footing the ENTIRE bill. No magnet schools, no charter schools, no vouchers, no specialized academies. Very simple. Very fair. The way it's been done for decades.
------------------- We do not see things as they are. We see them as we are.
------------The Talmud
posted on August 2, 2003 02:46:58 PM new
Here is some clarification about the school. According to Steve Guillard, who has followed the story since the school first opened, 20 years ago, the school is primarily for troubled children.
The program was supported , in large measure, by NYU. The two founders, Hetrick and Martin,
had taught there and got space from the university for their program, because there was a
desperate need for it.
Hetrick-Martin does outreach with gay youth and from what I was told, the kids they saw were at the end of their ropes, literally. They were saving kids from suicide, homelessness and sexual assault in their high schools. It wasn't for gay kids, but troubled kids who were gay and headed for the streets or an early grave.
The program is small, 100 kids, out of a high school population of 400,000. If it was merely
a school for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgendered kids, they would have to have in every
borough, serving anywhere from 20-40,000 kids at a minimum. Harvey Milk is not for "gay"
kids, but troubled kids. Kids who face physical violence in school. Some dismiss it as bullying,
but we're talking things as serious as assault with a deadly weapon to rape. Which gay and
bisexual kids are far, far less likely to report. Administrators are often indifferent to these attacks.
Harvey Milk exists so that these kids can get their consitutionally mandated educations safely.
Most gay kids attend New York's Public Schools with little problem. But for those facing eviction by homophobic parents, violence and sexual assault, there needs to be a place where they can continue to get their educations and become useful members of society.
- Harry Thompson