posted on August 13, 2003 11:51:51 AM new
Yep.....not in THEIR backyards.
Legendary newsman Walter Cronkite, a part-time resident of Martha's Vineyard, and Robert F. Kennedy Jr., whose famous political family has a compound in Hyannis, began campaigning against the renewable energy project last year.
Reminds me of the days when the drilling platforms were being proposed off the CA shore lines. Or more recently in Alaska. Everybody wants independence from foreign oil, but don't spoil the landscape....any where per the environmentalists.
But here's an environmentally safe alternative....and look who's up in arms LOL
posted on August 13, 2003 01:04:34 PM new
Notice the reams of posts by the left. lol
Cat got your tongues?
Here's an alternative to the energy crisis...could set a GREAT example for the rest of our country and your 'side', those RICH lefties, just won't have it. And no one to say they sure can't understand why.
Hey...these are the elected people who are on your side...fight for your rights....the rights of the 'little' guy. Least according to you.
posted on August 13, 2003 02:38:58 PM new
I don't know how you determine that the people opposed to this project are all Liberal Hypocrits.Is that conclusion based on the fact that Kennedy is a member of the group?
Or is that just a spin. Many working class residents oppose the project also, based on the potential impact on the fishing industry and marine life.
"Additional loss of fisheries production is likely, due to the direct loss of habitat and alteration of local patterns of water flow and sediment transport. Although the proponents tout the benefits of the added structure provided by the WTGs and bottom armoring riprap, we cannot support the conversion of such a large area of habitat. The fisheries community that has evolved at Horseshoe Shoals is dependent on the presence of an open, sandy shoal environment and conversion to a habitat dominated by high relief structures could have serious consequences to the functions and values of the area. These seemingly localized impacts would in turn have wide ranging effects as the waters of Nantucket Sound serve as essential fish habitat (EFH) under the Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation and Management Act for important fish stocks of the Middle Atlantic Bight."
- Massachusetts Marine Fisheries Commission
From marine life experts
"With respect to the genetic uniqueness of this population, the gray seals' dependence on the waters of Nantucket Sound strongly support protection of these and adjacent waters employing an ecosystem approach to management."
- Review of the State and Federal Marine Protection of the Biological Resources of Nantucket Sound (www.coastalstudies.org)
Navigation experts
"We feel strongly that the scope and location of this project will prove to be an additional navigational hazard to commercial and recreational boaters alike"
- Hy-Line Cruises
"In addition to direct consequences on commercial fishing, CCCHFA has serious concerns about the impact on vessel navigation caused by a project of this magnitude. Not only will ferry traffic and other boat traffic be altered, CCCHFA is concerned that the turbines could become an impediment to Coast Guard search and rescue efforts when lives are on the line."
- Cape Cod Hook Fishermen's Association
From Land use experts
"In its application for an Army Corps of Engineers (ACOE) Section 10 permit, the applicants have requested restrictions on other uses of the project area and a mile-wide corridor surrounding the project site."
- Office of Coastal Zone Management, 4/5/02
From Power Experts
Cape Cod and the islands export power. For the southeastern Massachusetts region - which includes Cape Cod - the regional power authority ISO New England projects that by 2006 we will have as much as a 54 percent power surplus. This area does not need new capacity for the foreseeable future.
According to the ISO New England's Regional Transmission Expansion Plan (RTEP) southeastern Massachusetts has "locked in generation." This means that there is adequate supply, but system bottlenecks prevent power from being transported to high demand areas.
The report also notes that upgrades to the system are needed in order to alleviate these bottlenecks. With the introduction of the Horseshoe Shoal project, considerable energy would flow off-Cape over high-voltage lines that are not designed for such loads.
- ISO New England Regional Transmission Expansion Plan
"While strongly suggesting that the power generated by this project will be directly available to residents of Cape Cod, in fact, the power generated by this project will be transmitted to the New England electric grid. Projects supplying power to the grid can be located anywhere in the New England region with suitable resources. The fact that no data on any other possible location has been provided is problematic." Read more
- Massachusetts Office of Coastal Zone Management
posted on August 13, 2003 05:31:36 PM new
LInda - I'm on the left... I just think happen to think that the complaints are assinine. I'm especially amused at the concept that those power generating windmills should not be erected as they will adversely effect recreational boating.
We have to start finding alternative forms of energy and this seems like a pretty good to me.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really Common Sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on August 13, 2003 05:44:47 PM new
More than ever it should be evident that we need to look at alternative energy solutions. Recreational boating, or the loss of it, should be the least of their problems. We can no longer afford to rely on oil. It's been the cause of too many problems.
Cheryl
Power to the people. Power to the people, right on. - John Lennon
posted on August 13, 2003 06:28:17 PM new
The major complaints are not assinine. The concerns of the working people are the effects on the commercial fishing industry and marine life. The complaint that you mention, fenix about boating is probably focused more on Coast Guard search and rescue efforts. Otherwise, I agree that boating is a minor issue.
posted on August 13, 2003 06:33:02 PM new
I doubt that anyone read my comment above so I'll add it here.
I don't know how you determine that the people opposed to this project are all Liberal Hypocrites.Is that conclusion based on the fact that Kennedy is a member of the group?
Or is that just a spin. Many working class residents oppose the project also, based on the potential impact on the fishing industry and marine life.
posted on August 13, 2003 06:41:41 PM new
Sorry linda, twelve, colin et al. This just isn't a right/left issue, try as you might to make it one.
___________________________________
What luck for the leaders that men do not think. - Adolph Hitler
posted on August 14, 2003 06:07:30 AM newHuh there profe?why not?
You'll notice that not everyone here "on the left" is in agreement on this project. I can't imagine that it's any different there.
___________________________________
What luck for the leaders that men do not think. - Adolph Hitler
posted on August 14, 2003 11:22:20 AM new
Great new standard profe51. So unless all members of a professed group agree totally on an issue position, then that issue position can not be applied to that group. If such is the case, then there isn't any issue position that can be applied to any political organization.
Not one person named in the articles is a conservative.
The area in question is a bastion for very rich liberals.
As far as the towers affecting the "working class" fishermen, they have a far larger issue with over fishing the whole region.
It is just another example of rich liberal hypocracy.
posted on August 14, 2003 12:14:26 PM new
Right on, Reamond!!! You call it like it is.
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fenix - Yes, I know that. I've always felt you were a more moderate democrat....more flexible than some here who never move from their party's stationary position. RIGID
Now, Cheryl's agreeing did surprise me....in a positive way.
profe - I did notice you haven't posted your position on this issue, thus the reason for my post. And you still haven't.
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Let's see...the left wants no more drilling for oil anywhere; no more wars for oil; no nuclear power plants; no dirty air from coal; and now no wind power.
Just how do those of you on the left think we should get the power we need if not by any of these methods? And is it okay that the rich liberals don't want energy producing wind farms near them? So where should we do this? Certainly not on land where it might distrub the fish, birds, wetlands, carabou or mice or....etc. LOL
I agreed only in that the need for alternative fuels is more urgent than ever. I am undecided as to whether they have found the best spot for them or not. I've never been to the area.
I don't think this issue is a right/left issue. How do you know that the people protesting the turbines are all on the left? Would seem a great many of them are also on the right. It is possible to have an issue that isn't political at all. I would protest a garbage dump in the lot behind me as would my republican neighbor.
Cheryl
Power to the people. Power to the people, right on. - John Lennon
Taking a position on this issue does not determine your political affiliation. Well-financed Boston developers are claiming that construction of the largest offshore wind energy plant in the world will have nothing but positive impacts on Cape Cod. Should I leap to a conclusion like you did and call these well financed people, fat cat Republicans????
The few people mentioned in the article represent a group position but not necessarily a political position such as you have described. Your description was used only to denigrate Liberals by calling them hypocrites.
In addition to the middle class workers who are concerned about the fishing industry and marine life, other organizations opposed to the construction
· Towns of Yarmouth, Barnstable, Mashpee, Chilmark, Edgartown & Nantucket
· Cape Cod Chamber of Commerce
· Hyannis Area Chamber of Commerce
· Falmouth Chamber of Commerce
· Chatham Chamber of Commerce
· Harwich Chamber of Commerce
· Martha's Vineyard Chamber of Commerce
· Yarmouth Area Chamber of Commerce
· Cape Cod & Islands Association of Realtors
· Hy-Line Cruises
· Steamship Authority
· Barnstable Economic Development Commission
· Nantucket Economic Development Commission
· Barnstable Land Trust
· Osterville Village Association
· Hyannis Civic Association
· Cotuit Civic Association
posted on August 14, 2003 01:03:22 PM new
Okay Cheryl - That's fair enough. My point with this is that there will NEVER be an appropriate spot that the enviornmentalists would agree to. And most radical enviornmentalitsts ARE liberals.
There are studies being done to see what problems this might present to the area...yes. But what is really clear to see is that it's another 'not in my neighborhood' by the wealth only this time the MAJOR opposition/support is from those on the left who are fighting against it.
You are aware, like Reamond stated above, that the three names mentioned in the article are liberals and J. Kennedy is an enviornmental attorney...his specialty.
posted on August 14, 2003 01:07:51 PM newNot one person named in the articles is a conservative.
Of course, that would ruin the neo-con slant of the article. In one of those news programs, it turns out EVERYONE, liberal AND conservative is against the windmill project.
You didn't notice ANY conservatives coming out FOR they project, did you?
But that would screw up the purpose of your slam, wouldn't it? And you wouldn't really want the whole truth to come out, would you?
Reamond, you may not bald-face lie, but you LOVE a good half-truth...which is a good as lying....
posted on August 14, 2003 01:12:24 PM new
okay mlecher - Instead of doing what you on the left are so great at doing...critizing...with no offer of an alternative...why don't YOU answer my question?
Just how do those of you on the left think we should get the power we need if not by any of these methods?
"Because southeastern Massachusetts operates with a power surplus this massive project will not directly benefit Cape Cod or the islands. The power forecast for our area is so robust that the region's current capacity of 31,000 megawatts is already more than adequate to meet a projected peak demand of 25,120 megawatts. On top of that existing capacity, ISO says there is another 3,500 megawatts under construction in New England that would be added to the power grid, ensuring adequate supply for years to come. And many other new renewable energy projects have been announced qualifying under the Massachusetts Renewable Portfolio Standard (RPS), thus satisfying the growing demand for clean energy to reduce global warming gases."
posted on August 14, 2003 01:31:05 PM new
I'll tell you how Linda K- While the rich liberals drive around in the SUVS/Limos/planes/yatchs, they want the hoi poli vulgar mob of "poor" people to ride in public transit, separate their garbage for recycling, live in high density tenements, and
posted on August 14, 2003 01:31:36 PM new
Turn down your thermostat. Drive a fuel efficient car that pollutes less instead of that SUV Sports Tank Caravan Piece of Junk ala Detroit. Carpool. Public Transporatation. Eliminate Daylight Savings Time. On and on.
I have no idea as to the specifics of this project and really no opinion on the specific project or who is pro and who is con.
posted on August 14, 2003 02:41:04 PM newthat would be added to the power grid.
Helen...just like CA purchases it's energy from many states....just because this area [you say] has enough to meet their needs, doesn't mean it can't be sold to other areas. The more energy there is...the less the cost to the end user... US!
There should be no reason, imo, why those who want to maintain their unspoiled coastal view/landscape should be the ones blocking this.
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Yes, dave, those are all good suggestions. But the people who are interested in saving energy are most likely already doing so. We still need XXXX units of energy to maintain/substain our current industry, etc. Our usage requirements are growing along with our population. We need/want more. Where is this to come from if not one of the above mentioned sources?
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reamond...I think you pulled a 'linda' and hit the post button too soon. But, of course I agree.
[ edited by Linda_K on Aug 14, 2003 02:44 PM ]
