posted on August 31, 2004 12:23:52 AM new
While watching the RNC tonight, I learned that Michael Moore would be covering the event (USA Today decided to provide commentators/opinions from both sides). So, I mosied on over to the USA Today site to read what he had to say. And I must say, he was spot on with his column today.
The GOP doesn't reflect America
Michael Moore, Filmmaker
NEW YORK — Welcome, Republicans. You're proud Americans who love your country. In your own way, you want to make this country a better place. Whatever our differences, you should be commended for that.
But what's all this talk about New York being enemy territory? Nothing could be further from the truth. We New Yorkers love Republicans. We have a Republican mayor and governor, a death penalty and two nuclear plants within 30 miles of the city.
New York is home to Fox News Channel. The top right-wing talk shows emanate from here — Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly among them. The Wall Street Journal is based here, which means your favorite street is here. Not to mention more Fortune 500 executives than anywhere else.
You may think you're surrounded by a bunch of latte-drinking effete liberals, but the truth is, you're right where you belong, smack in the seat of corporate America and conservative media.
Let me also say I admire your resolve. You're true believers. Even though only a third of the country defines itself as "Republican," you control the White House, Congress, Supreme Court and most state governments.
You're in charge because you never back down. Your people are up before dawn figuring out which minority group shouldn't be allowed to marry today.
Our side is full of wimps who'd rather compromise than fight. Not you guys.
Hanging out around the convention, I've encountered a number of the Republican faithful who aren't delegates. They warm up to me when they don't find horns or a tail. Talking to them, I discover they're like many people who call themselves Republicans but aren't really Republicans. At least not in the radical-right way that George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, John Ashcroft and Co. have defined Republicans.
I asked one man who told me he was a "proud Republican," "Do you think we need strong laws to protect our air and water?"
"Well, sure," he said. "Who doesn't?"
I asked whether women should have equal rights, including the same pay as men.
"Absolutely," he replied.
"Would you discriminate against someone because he or she is gay?"
"Um, no." The pause — I get that a lot when I ask this question — is usually because the average good-hearted person instantly thinks about a gay family member or friend.
I've often found that if I go down the list of "liberal" issues with people who say they're Republican, they are quite liberal and not in sync with the Republicans who run the country. Most don't want America to be the world's police officer and prefer peace to war. They applaud civil rights, believe all Americans should have health insurance and think assault weapons should be banned. Though they may personally oppose abortion, they usually don't think the government has the right to tell a women what to do with her body.
There's a name for these Republicans: RINOs or Republican In Name Only. They possess a liberal, open mind and don't believe in creating a worse life for anyone else.
So why do they use the same label as those who back a status quo of women earning 75 cents to every dollar a man earns, 45 million people without health coverage and a president who has two more countries left on his axis-of-evil-regime-change list?
I asked my friend on the street. He said what I hear from all RINOs: "I don't want the government taking my hard-earned money and taxing me to death. That's what the Democrats do."
Money. That's what it comes down to for the RINOs. They do work hard and have been squeezed even harder to make ends meet. They blame Democrats for wanting to take their money. Never mind that it's Republican tax cuts for the rich and billions spent on the Iraq war that have created the largest deficits in history and will put all of us in hock for years to come.
The Republican Party's leadership knows America is not only filled with RINOs, but most Americans are much more liberal than the delegates gathered in New York.
The Republicans know it. That's why this week we're seeing gay-loving Rudy Giuliani, gun-hating Michael Bloomberg and abortion-rights advocate Arnold Schwarzenegger.
As tough of a pill as it is to swallow, Republicans know that the only way to hold onto power is to pass themselves off as, well, as most Americans. It's a good show.
So have a good time, Republicans. It could be your last happy party for awhile if all the RINOs and liberal majority figure it out on Nov. 2.
posted on August 31, 2004 04:32:56 AM newAs tough of a pill as it is to swallow, Republicans know that the only way to hold onto power is to pass themselves off as, well, as most Americans. It's a good show.
I got news for Michael Moore. The philosophy which affects to teach us a contempt of money (which his contempt of republicans is really all about) does not run very deep. That is the left's problem. Always "emoting" trying to undermine reason with just some gutteral instinct. It's too bad though, he is so very unlucky, that his most infinite contempt for a party of "passed-off Americans" as he calls them -is the very same one that feeds his strongest appetite for the pleasures and purpose he procures in this life.
..
[ edited by neroter12 on Aug 31, 2004 04:37 AM ]
posted on August 31, 2004 06:02:13 AM new
neroter12, most non wealthy and wealthy Democrats along with Moore don't have contempt for money. They only have contempt for the wealthy greedy,self-serving,cold hearted rich people in the republican party. The people that are fighting a class war trying their very best to destroy the middle and working class Americans. Bush and his republican party attract these kind of people like flies on $hit. That is what this election is all about.
I just heard on the radio the latest news from Iraq. The news is this 966 American troops dead, over 6000 wounded and no oil is flowing. Don't you think the Iraq war has something to do with this election?
Your type of republican wants 2 Americans. We Democrats want a better America for all.
IF ELECTED JOHN KERRY AND JOHN EDWARDS WILL BRING A BETTER AMERICA FOR ALL.
posted on August 31, 2004 06:13:12 AM new
"As tough of a pill as it is to swallow, Republicans know that the only way to hold onto power is to pass themselves off as, well, as most Americans. It's a good show."
They're trying to wipe away four years of failure with no mention of the catastrophic failure in Iraq, or the failure of the economy. The Republican Convention is just a facade in which, as Clinton noted, "the GOP is "putting its once-every-four-years compassionate face on." So, they trot out a couple of Asskissing moderate Republicans, McCain and Guilanni to cover for the radical right and the creeps really in charge...Rove, Delay, Cheney, Ashcroft and Wolfowitz.
posted on August 31, 2004 06:13:54 AM new
Neroter says, " got news for Michael Moore. The philosophy which affects to teach us a contempt of money (which his contempt of republicans is really all about) does not run very deep. That is the left's problem. Always "emoting" trying to undermine reason with just some gutteral instinct. It's too bad though, he is so very unlucky, that his most infinite contempt for a party of "passed-off Americans" as he calls them -is the very same one that feeds his strongest appetite for the pleasures and purpose he procures in this life. "
What a load of pompous poppycock !
Neroter , don't try so hard to sound like Linda, you both end up sounding ridiculous.
Moore's article has nothing to do with contempt for money or wealth. Anyway, DUH, there are plenty of wealthy Democrats. But you're a neocon and so missed the whole point of the article on purpose. YOU are jealous of everyone and so all your arguments revolve around jealousy...that just doesn't make any sense.
I didn't see any "emoting" ...just facts.
Neroter, if you're trying to pass yourself off as a great writer, take a class, read Mark Twain, read Michael Moore.
Your verbiose bombasity is hilarious but it's still lousy writing. Don't try to write over your head or like someone else.
That last sentence is a doozy and if you read it again (and again and again) you'll see it makes no sense!
If it means Moore's rich, ya, so what?
But it really is hard to tell exactly what you mean.
How about," Michael Moore seems to be against the rich but doesn't mind getting rich himself."
That ain't great writing either but much more "honest" than that mess you wrote.
..
posted on August 31, 2004 06:27:07 AM new
Moore should of asked that man if he thinks homosexuals should be allowed to marry... I think he would of gotten a different answer... most people do not see that as discrimination... which it is not.
Moore asked questions which could only be answered in the affirmative, however nothing he has done is really against the GOP, does the GOP want clean air and water... you bet... however progress should not be hindered in a way that it stunts growth, the GOP seeks a balance.
When a woman can do the same work as a man, they should receive the same pay, that glass ceiling syndrome is becoming a dead horse...I know of know job where a man makes more just because he is a man. It maybe becuase he is willing to work harder and longer...
moore asked questions he knew would get the response he wanted... nothing knew there... but then again he didn't aske me
posted on August 31, 2004 07:01:56 AM newWhile watching the RNC tonight, I learned that Michael Moore would be covering the event
Where in that entire dissertation was there any sort of a report on the RNC and I never saw Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly talking at the RNC. There was no mention of Rudy Giuliani's or John McCain's speech that I saw.
Once again Michael Moore just blows hot air. Spot on with his column was he but where's his report.
posted on August 31, 2004 07:17:16 AM new
Oh, it does so have everything to do with it!! He came from a poorazz Irish family and forget the fact that HE is no longer poor - he cant get past the idea its no longer 1932!
gcrosey: My pompousness is all my own - honey bunch of oats and whey! Linda is not quite mental enough to come out with the things about you as I - who can go where you are! And of course its hard for a mental case like you to 'tell what one means' because you cannot latch anything on to it other than what it says.
[ edited by neroter12 on Aug 31, 2004 07:19 AM ]
posted on August 31, 2004 07:23:21 AM new
LOL Neroter, me thinks thee speaks in tongues!
I personally love it! It's like my puzzle for the day. Good job!Doc
posted on August 31, 2004 08:35:49 AM new
From the dark ages of idiocy,
"When a woman can do the same work as a man, they should receive the same pay, that glass ceiling syndrome is becoming a dead horse...I know of know job where a man makes more just because he is a man. It maybe becuase he is willing to work harder and longer... "
How laughable!
Poor Twelve, hasn't known too many women obviously, never read history, doesn't know laws, has never had a job, is very insecure, and drags knuckles .
Then, neroter,
"Oh, it does so have everything to do with it!! He came from a poorazz Irish family and forget the fact that HE is no longer poor - he cant get past the idea its no longer 1932!"
I have no idea what 1932 has to do with this but here's a neocon berating someone who did just what neocons say people should do....want money? Work for it.
posted on August 31, 2004 09:44:05 AM new
Welcome Republicans????
LOL LOL LOL
Yes, their so very welcome to NY that the justice department is now checking into who passed out lists of the Republicans names, email address, where they'll be eating, staying, etc.
So that the protesters can go harass them. LOL
Then, of course, there's always the rncunwelcome.org web site. Groups that have been formed which keeps those who wish to harass and plan violent protests during the RNC convention in touch with one another.
----
There's already a police officer in the hospital in critical condition, from a beating he/she took from these supposed protestors yesterday. And I have a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach that this is only the beginning of what these groups have planned to get attention and disrupt the convention[/b].
Read the NYT article on the justice department investigation of their plans.
---------
Here's some snipets:
Subpoena Seeks Records About Delegate Lists on Web
By ERIC LICHTBLAU
Published: August 30, 2004
WASHINGTON, Aug. 29 - The Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation and is demanding records regarding Internet postings by critics of the Bush administration that list the names of Republican delegates and urge protesters to give them an unwelcome reception in New York City.
Federal prosecutors said in a grand jury subpoena that the information was needed as part of an investigation into possible voter intimidation. Protesters and civil rights advocates argued that the Web postings were legitimate political dissent, not threats or intimidation.
The investigation, conducted by the Secret Service, comes at a time when federal officials have begun an aggressive effort to prevent what they say could be violence by demonstrators at the convention this week and at other major political events. Large-scale demonstrations in New York began over the weekend.
The Federal Bureau of Investigation has questioned at least several dozen would-be protesters about whether they knew of any plans for violent demonstrations, and it has directed agents nationwide to identify possible criminal plots.
A senior Justice Department official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the department was sensitive to First Amendment concerns. But when officials were alerted to the posting of the names and identifying information for delegates, they were concerned about the prospect that delegates could be harassed or become victims of identity theft, and they wanted to know why the information was posted, the official said.
"When you're confronted with something like this, you can't just ignore it," the official said. "I think people would expect us to look into it and find out whether there is anything going on here that goes beyond the bounds of free speech."
The Justice Department issued the subpoena on Aug. 19 to Calyx Internet Access, an Internet service provider in New York City, after a Secret Service agent asked the company to turn over information about postings on a client's site, nyc.indymedia.org. Calyx refused to turn over the information, citing privacy concerns, and a subpoena was issued.
The subpoena seeks subscriber information, and contacts and billing records for the Indy Media site. It says the information is needed to investigate possible violations of the federal criminal code barring efforts to intimidate, threaten or coerce voters.
The Indy Media site is run by the NYC Independent Media Center......The site includes several lists containing the names of many delegates to the Republican convention, along with e-mail addresses, phone numbers and the hotels where some were expected to stay, as well as links to a site called rncdelegates.com.
Most of the lists were posted anonymously or by demonstrators calling themselves the RNC Delegates Working Group.
"The delegates should know not only what people think of the platform that they will ratify, but that they are not welcome in New York City," organizers said in a posting.
---------------
Yea, some welcome...NOT!!! Harassment and disruption from the left.
posted on August 31, 2004 09:47:51 AM new
As far as the conventions go....and the mention of few true 'far-rightwingers'.....it was much more laughable to watch the DNC convention and how they kept their 'radical ultra-ultra lefties' quiet. And their platform was presented so far to the 'right' as to appear almost Republican - Patriotic and approving of this Iraqi war.
posted on August 31, 2004 09:56:33 AM newThere's already a police officer in the hospital in critical condition, from a beating he/she took from these supposed protestors yesterday.
Linda, would you be kind enough to give me a link where I can find this? I didn't see it or hear about it so I just want to check it out. Thanks.
posted on August 31, 2004 10:03:09 AM new
neroter - Linda is not quite...
Here's how I see it. You are much more articulate than I. You have a great command of the English language...far superior than mine. Those are the facts, woman. I'm fully aware of my strengths and also my weaknesses, so you won't be offending me.
posted on August 31, 2004 10:08:31 AM new
sure, trai, please give me a few minutes as I read several sites each morning. I'll post it as soon as I find it.
posted on August 31, 2004 10:24:34 AM new
From the NYT today...I'll post the link.
When marchers approached the Garden, a police detective was knocked off his scooter. He was then repeatedly kicked and punched in the head by at least one male demonstrator, the police said.
The detective, William Sample, was listed in serious condition at St. Vincent's Manhattan Hospital, where Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg and Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly both visited him, the police said. There was no immediate word of an arrest in the assault, but as of 9 p.m., the police said there had been 11 protest-related arrests.
The heavy police presence at the Garden apparently inspired the coordinated plan by anarchists and other radicals to strike out at the delegates at their hotels, breakfasts, parties, and on the streets.
The incidents are the result of months of planning by opposition groups, who report that they have obtained copies of plans and addresses for delegates' parties, caucuses and other gatherings outside the Garden.
Their efforts are aided by a support network that uses cellphone text messaging. Text message was also used extensively in a bike protest on Friday night and during demonstrations in Times Square on Sunday.
"CT delegation breakfast everyday @ Maison (7th ave & 53rd) from 7-8:30. Can we get some dissenters?" said one text message yesterday, apparently referring to the Connecticut delegation's plan to gather at a Midtown restaurant. "Maison has outdoor buffet. It would be direct contact with delegates."
One Internet discussion list used by protesters posted an advisory about where some delegate buses would be idling in Midtown every morning. Another message included phone numbers and e-mail addresses for convention officials and advised that delegate hotels would be busiest in the morning and evening.
The police are bracing for another round of unsanctioned demonstrations today, which protesters have designated a day of "nonviolent civil disobedience and direct action."
Among the parties expected to be a target is the Tennessee delegation's gathering at Sotheby's. A group calling itself the Man in Black Bloc plans to protest it, saying it is angered that the convention intends to honor the late country singer Johnny Cash.
posted on August 31, 2004 10:35:16 AM new
Republicans chose New York so that they could wrap their convention in images of 9/11. They chose New York so that they could take the city's grief and use it to advance their agenda. They wanted to take the memory of those days when we mourned together, honored our public workers, and asserted that New York's diversity was a source of strength, and use it as the backdrop for their pageant. I wouldn't be surprised if Bush visited the 9/11 site within the next couple of days..
They chose New York because they thought they could get away with it... it looks like it may have backfired in their face. You are correct, they are not being welcomed. Doc
posted on August 31, 2004 10:56:08 AM newThey chose New York because they thought they could get away with it
Get away with having a convention anywhere in the US? Oh brother...that's a good one. So now the left thinks they have the power to tell a sitting President where he can and cannot hold his convention? ROFLMHO...just proves how the left really tries to restrict freedoms...freedoms they CLAIM to want for all....just not Republicans. I can't believe you'd even say that!!!!!
... it looks like it may have backfired in their face.
I disagree....it will point out the everyone how violent the left is and that they promote/condone this type of behavior. It won't look good for their lack of restrain.
You are correct, they are not being welcomed. Doc
A sad day in America where a political party - the extreme lefties - condone and promote 'doing whatever it takes' to silence those who hold different political views.
And you're agreement that they are not welcome in NY just goes to prove that Michael Moore has never had a 'clue' about what he continues to sprew....his hatred...and still doesn't as his statements in this topic article show.
posted on August 31, 2004 11:00:51 AM new
Thanks, reading this over I do notice that it was an isolated incident. We still don't know what the actual cause of this was and will have to wait until the police report comes out.
However to be fair here one cannot claim this was a bunch of democrats attacking police officers.
Anymore than you can say if this was a Republican demonstration it was the fault of them due to the actions of a few people. Unfortunately any demonstration or event draws the fringe groups or whack jobs. With all the dirty tricks there are paid agitators too. Takes all kinds. For the amount of people involved it was a very peaceful demonstration.
posted on August 31, 2004 11:02:30 AM new
Doc, they're just jealous.
There was NO huge protest against Kerry at the DNC.
Linda's posts are laughable at best.
Does she REALLY think the Republicans weren't pulling every dirty trick in the book to get info on Dems? How about Norm(The REAL Flip-Flopper) Coleman and his War Room down the block from the DNC.....first time in history any party did something like this spin room.
If she wants to C&P every misstep by a protester why doesn't she go back to the 18th century....there were some doozies but they got us a COUNTRY!
How about every lie, every dirty trick, every rotten thing bush has done to harm people in the last 3 1/2 years.....sorry even the Internet isn't big enough to hold it all. But evil attracts evil so she'll stick to bush.
posted on August 31, 2004 11:28:22 AM new
It is just not the Presidents descion where to hold the GOP convention. The GOP party decides long ago where it is, and they decided on NYC.
There were no protesters at the Dem Convention. No kidding. Kerry is not the current President.
I liked Michael Moore using the 'L' for LOSER when McCain made the comment about him.
posted on August 31, 2004 11:34:27 AM new
Ya, the left is so violent...we just hate wars.
Good grief, the right loves war and torture and gets all atwiddle about a cop falling off his scooter.?!?!?!?!?!?
I bet THIS is covered by the Right controlled media....but don't you dare show those caskets coming back from Iraq!!!!!!!!
THAT's certainly not as important as those "atrocious" incidents caused by protesters!!
Duh, LINDUH....guess what,
If it wasn't for protesters and the first political demonstrators YOU wouldn't have the right to vote...
These brave women were being arrested,jailed, divorced, abandoned by their families, and reviled just for the right to vote.
Of course, YOU wouldn't have been there even if you had been alive then.....you'd be hiding under the bed throwing pot shots at those "trouble makers".
There were THOUSANDS of peaceful demonstrators in NY on Sunday.....and your stupid "SPIN" just ain't going to cut it!
posted on August 31, 2004 11:49:13 AM new
trai - Even one person ending up with his head kicked in is terrible....and what I said was that I feared from ALL I've read...that this is only a sign of more to come. I was NOT basing that opinion only on this ONE article. But rather on many articles that are reporting violence to the Republican deligates who are in NY. There have been many reports of them showing up to harass - toe-to-toe, nose-to-nose, pushing, screaming, calling names, etc. and police were called on to brake it up.
One person who was interviewed, another delegate said he's NEVER seen such anger, violence, threats coming from democrats. He stated he had friends who were dems and they just agreed to disagree....NOT GET SO VIOLENT with others!!
Unfortunately any demonstration or event draws the fringe groups or whack jobs.
No, I disagree....this mainly occurs from those on the left....the UNpeaceful protestors...the anti-American groups the left loves to get support from.
For the amount of people involved it was a very peaceful demonstration. It was only the first day and if you read the concerns of the security forces there have been reports/speculation that a most violent group of these fanatics ARE planning more violence. Time will tell.
posted on August 31, 2004 11:56:07 AM new
NearTheSea - That picture of MM looks to me like the one I saw when the camera panned over to him during McCain's convention speech. The part of McCain's speech where he was speaking to MM statements/film....and as that happened the crowd was chanting....four more years, four more years, four more years.
posted on August 31, 2004 12:09:04 PM new
I think I like his way of thinking, Michael Moore understands the primary motivation of the American voter. Money. But wait, one can make the case that things were 'better' under Clinton. We decimated our military, closed down bases and cut the cost of government, other than transfer payments. Boom times for other reasons.
Michael Moore is correct, many people are not pleased with some aspects of the Republican administration. In a two party system, which we effectively have, the Republican party is the only refuge you have if you repudiate anything the Democratic Party alleges to represent.
So, I reflect to Mr. Moore, he is absolutely right. The battle for control of the U.S.A. and it's direction is not won or lost on economic issues, foreign involvement, or social programs; but, rather in the hearts and minds of the voters and their core beliefs. Mr. Moore finds amusement that the herd is so stupid as to follow the Republican line. They aren't, Mr. Moore. They just refuse to follow the Democratic line. Why is that, Mr. Moore? Do you understand that it might be about family values, life style, and defending ourselves? I think that the problem might be that Mr. Moore regrets not being with a part of the population he so identifies with.
Prevent Bigotry through Education.
Doc
I'm fully aware of my strengths and also my weaknesses, so you won't be offending me. 