posted on September 2, 2004 01:07:13 PM new
Well, we have thousands of "swift vets" threads and equally as many "Bush snuck out" threads - so let's have one about the actual issues here:
Now before you all jump down my throat about another C&P.. please take the time to read this.. what strikes me is that there is very little difference between Bush and Kerry on most issues...
IRAQ
Bush: Post-war violence and the prison abuse scandal shook public support for the Iraq invasion, but Bush says war was right because Iraq knew how to make WMD and could have told terrorists.
Kerry: Supported invasion of Iraq and would be ready to send more troops. Would like a US-led Nato force to take responsibility for security. Has accused Bush of exaggerating WMD threat.
Nader: Calls for withdrawal from Iraq "quagmire" and an end to the "US corporate takeover" of Iraqi economy. Says case for war was "faulty and fabricated" and Arab / Muslim peacekeepers are needed.
WAR ON TERROR
Bush: Created Department of Homeland Security. Has tripled security funding and pushed for 2001 Patriot Act, which boosts official powers to monitor citizens and detain terrorism suspects.
Kerry: Would reform domestic intelligence putting National Guard in charge of homeland security. Wants amendments to Patriot Act, to increase rights of detainees. Would focus anew on Afghanistan.
Nader: Says war on terror is eroding civil liberties and due process of law, while exposing US Muslims to arbitrary surveillance. Wants to repeal Patriot Act and to end military tribunals for civilians.
GAY MARRIAGE
Bush: Wants Congress to amend constitution to define marriage as between a man and a woman only. Has no problem with states passing laws allowing civil unions for gays.
Kerry: Opposes Bush's proposed constitutional amendment. Also opposes gay marriage, but says states should have power to decide whether to allow it.
Nader: Supports same-sex marriages because gays should be treated equally under the law. Says Bush is trying to "mandate inequality".
ABORTION
Bush: Opposes abortion except in cases of rape or incest, or where a woman's life is in danger. Signed into law a ban on late-term "partial-birth" abortion.
Kerry: Supports woman's right to choose, though opposes third-trimester abortions unless for health reasons. Would appoint only pro-choice Supreme Court judges.
Nader: Supports access to "safe and legal" abortion. Opposes attempts to restrict birth control or abortion through legislation or constitutional amendment.
EDUCATION
Bush: His No Child Left Behind Act ties federal school funding to results of student tests. Favours federally funded vouchers to help parents afford private schools.
Kerry: Would provide $27bn to "fully fund" No Child left Behind Act. Would recruit more teachers, and pay the best more. Against vouchers for private education.
Nader: Says No Child Left Behind Act puts too much emphasis on testing. Would guarantee pre-school education for all children. Wants schools to teach citizenship.
HEALTH
Bush: Proposes tax credits for low earners who take out health insurance, to help cut numbers without access to health care. Has introduced a prescription drug benefit for elderly people.
Kerry: Proposes opening up the existing health care programme for federal government employees to all adults, and giving money to states to help them reduce the number of uninsured children.
Nader: Wants government-financed universal health care, delivered by non-profit companies. Would abolish health-insurance industry and bar profit-making organisations from health sector.
BUDGET / TAXES
Bush: The US had a budget surplus in 2000 but now has a huge deficit. Bush has proposed steps to halve it by 2010 - but wants Congress to make permanent tax cuts he made in 2001-2003.
Kerry: Promises to cut budget deficit by repealing Bush tax cuts for high earners and pegging federal spending increases to the rate of inflation, except in areas of defence, security and education.
Nader:Would make rich people and businesses pay more tax. Industries "we dislike" would pay most - ie polluters, the alcohol, tobacco and gambling industries and makers of "extreme luxuries".
JOBS / TRADE
Bush: Promises to enforce trade agreements so that US producers compete on a level playing field. Proposes spending more on training at community colleges and vocational schools.
Kerry: Promises to create 10 million jobs by 2009. Would review all trade agreements in first 120 days in office, to check that exporting countries meet labour and environmental standards.
Nader: Proposes creating jobs through public infrastructure projects. Wants equitable trade that promotes higher rather than lower environmental standards and better working conditions.
posted on September 2, 2004 02:34:11 PM new
Dr.D - While I agree that it appears they're close together on many issues they really aren't. It's just that during his campaigning season, kerry, has come from the extreme left [ultra-ultra voting record] to appear to be more 'centralist'...which he's not.
And, imo, the MAJOR difference between the two is that President Bush has always held the same positions.....while kerry keeps changing his positions on the issues.
But, on your list, I got as far as reading this:
abortion: Kerry: Supports woman's right to choose, though opposes third-trimester abortions unless for health reasons. Would appoint only pro-choice Supreme Court judges.
I question this because I have only read and heard him say he totally is against all abortions personally, but supports a woman's right to choice. I have NEVER seen it written that he has expressed the limitation stated above. [3rd tri-mesters] He VOTED against the partial abortion ban
posted on September 2, 2004 02:47:13 PM new
from the Washington Post June 3, 2004
The abortion issue that has Democrats the most concerned -- a ban on the procedure critics call partial-birth abortion -- is resurfacing after a federal judge in San Francisco ruled on Tuesday that the ban is unconstitutional.
Kerry voted against the ban, which Bush signed into law, because he said it does not provide adequate protections for a woman's health. Several Democrats, including Senate Minority Leader Thomas A. Daschle (S.D.), backed Bush on the ban -- support that Republicans are using to paint Kerry as outside of the mainstream.
"Americans from across the political spectrum oppose partial birth abortion because they support a culture of life, but John Kerry returned to the Senate last year to oppose the partial birth abortion ban," Marc Racicot.
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One of only 14% of the times this year kerry returned to DC to vote.
posted on September 2, 2004 02:48:22 PM new
Linda, you are once again spewing crap from your fingers as you type. Kerry isn't ultra liberal, he isn't even liberal. He is more moderate liberal than anything.
Give me a few examples of Kerry's "ultra-ultra liberal voting record" and make sure it includes those every so evil riders we love so much. You know what I mean. Those riders that the neo-cons love to tack onto any significant bill to attempt to make the Democrats look bad. You know the ones... the ones used in just about every speech so far to attack Kerry at the RNC, the same ones used to attack Kerry on every Bush commercial. Come on Linda, please also include those bills that the Republicans remove important verbage to make practical legislation a reality. You know, come on Linda.
posted on September 2, 2004 02:53:55 PM new
rusty - I've shown you before the different studies that two different groups have taken on how our Senators vote...comparing their votes to one another. kerry ranked # 1 and edwards # 4 as being two of the MOST left leaning Senators in Congress.
Now...rather than arguing with me....why don't you do as Dr. D asks and stick to discussing the issue rather than slandering me and my opinions for once!!!
I believe that Rusty's question is a fair one, lindak. I can't imagine what you mean by Kerry's "ultra-ultra liberal voting record".
Helen
And BTW...“John Kerry voted to restrict late-term abortions but only where there was a clear exception for life or health of women. However, George Bush pushed through a different piece of legislation that failed to protect the health of women and that is what the Court struck down. When John Kerry is President he will appoint judges that are committed to upholding the Constitution not pursuing an ideological agenda.”
posted on September 2, 2004 04:33:06 PM new
Linda, in all fairness, I think the Bush camp is trying to move him (or make it appear) he is more to the center as well. Today I was listening to the radio....just happened on this station in the car...but they were discussing the daughters speech. A very conservative women expressed that she felt many conservatives were highly disappointed with the attempt to make them appear hip and the reference to sex in the city.,etc.
You know what surprized me? She said she was a speechwriter for so many years for such n such and all the speeches had to be approved by 4-5 people before they get aired.
And,...get this...she said she was pretty sure Karen Hughes wrote most of it!! That really surprised me. Another 'head' on the show stated they were trying to appeal to a younger audience as the kerry girls did, but it didnt quite go off as well as they would have liked.
So I conclude they are both trying to meet a center they normally do not cater to. mo
..
..
~~ Keep thy heart with all diligence for out of it are the issues(forces)of life..Proverbs 4:23~~
posted on September 2, 2004 04:50:59 PM new
neroter - I agree with you, in part. I don't agree that President Bush is a neo-con nor a neocon-nazi...he's not a far right-winger. He's not as far right as say Falwell or Pat Robertson are. That's the way the left tries to portray him. If he were he'd have been making much different statements....like going for no abortions...not just limiting partial birth abortions. He'd never have approved the Medicare bill/drug bill....etc.
I will agree he's a conservative....but not as far right, in reality, as kerry is ultra left/liberal.
posted on September 2, 2004 04:55:15 PM new
helen - Kerry voted against the partial abortion bill, even in the third tri-mester. Period.
As the AMA has stated there is no medical reason a woman's health would be in danger....that it would be necessary to put that phrase in there.
The left wants the wording that way so the bill would mean nothing....a woman could claim her mental health is effected and get a very late term abortion.
Anyway....kerry's vote was once again in the minority and the bill was passed. He does not represent main-stream America's view on this issue either.
Now, the bill is being challenged...and will most likely end up in the USSC.
posted on September 2, 2004 06:19:34 PM new
Here is one more reason why I won't vote for Bush:
Evidently, the Bush administration has proposed a plan to eliminate
HIV/AIDS education that includes accurate information on condom use.
Published in the June 16 Federal Register, the proposed Centers for
Disease Control guidelines will be mandatory for any organization that
does HIV-prevention work and receives federal funds (even if the federal
money isn't spent on an HIV program). Nearly every agency that offers
HIV-prevention education receives some federal dollars. Without that
money, they'll have to slash programs or even close.
These new regulations require the censoring of any "content" --
including pamphlets, posters, photographs, slides, advertising and
websites. All "content" must eliminate anything even vaguely "sexually
suggestive" -- like teaching how to use a condom correctly. Even worse,
all materials must include information on the "lack of effectiveness of
condom use" in preventing the spread of HIV and other STDs.
In other words, the Bush administration wants programs that fight AIDS
to tell people that condoms don't work. However, it has long been an
established scientific, medical FACT that condoms are the one measure
that is the most effective, almost 100% effective, in preventing
transmission of the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) from an infected
person to another person.
In addition:
Shrunken AIDS funding in President Bush's 2005 budget proposal released Monday (Feb. 2) dampened the spirits of Christian groups and aid organizations, who said he is not following through on his promise to combat the disease globally.
"We all heard (Bush) make a very powerful and passionate statement about global AIDS in last year's State of the Union, but this year he didn't say anything about AIDS," said the Rev. David Beckmann, president of Bread for the World, a grass-roots Christian anti-hunger lobby group. "Now that we see his budget, it's clear that he's not willing to make financial commitments that are in keeping with his promises of a year ago."
Evidently Bush can not keep his promises and is using the same failed technique used by conservatives to prevent pregancy - stop the spread of HIV by not having sex....
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
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We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
