posted on November 21, 2004 09:11:38 PM new
Five dead, three injured after hunter denied access to tree stand
By MEG JONES
[email protected]
Posted: Nov. 21, 2004
Hayward - Five deer hunters were shot to death and three were wounded Sunday by a man who was hunting from someone else's tree stand in northern Wisconsin, authorities said.
The bizarre attack happened in the Sawyer County Town of Meteor about noon on the second day of the gun-deer season, a time when hundreds of thousands of deer hunters are in the woods.
Sawyer County Chief Deputy Tim Zeigle said a man from the Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minn. area, was arrested about 5 p.m. in Birchwood, just across the Sawyer County border in Washburn County.
Authorities said the rampage started after a hunting party saw a hunter they didn't know occupying their tree stand. That led to a confrontation. One victim used a walkie-talkie to call for help, but when other hunting partners came to the scene they also were shot, said Zeigle.
Some of the victims were from the Rice Lake area.
The wounded - all men - were taken to Lakeview Medical Center in Rice Lake. One man who was more seriously wounded than the other two was airlifted to St. Joseph Hospital in Marshfield where he was in critical condition. The other men were in stable and fair condition Sunday evening after surgery, a Lakeview Medical Center spokesman said.
Bill Wagner, 72, of Oshkosh, was about two miles away near Deer Lake with a party of about 20 other hunters. He said the incident was "very upsetting."
After they got word of a shooting, he and others went to round up the rest of the party. He said they heard sirens, planes and helicopters and noticed the surrounding roads blocked off.
"When you're hunting you don't expect somebody to try to shoot you and murder you," he said. "You have no idea who is coming up to you."
It took about three hours to round up the other hunters, who were up to four miles apart, Wagner said.
The incident won't dampen their hunt, he said.
"We're all old, dyed-in-wool hunters," he said. "We wouldn't go home because of this but we will keep it in our minds. We're not forgetting it."
Jon Sleik, chairman of the Town of Cedar Lake, in neighboring Barron County, said after rumors began flowing that the victims were from the Rice Lake area, many families were worried and desperate for information.
"It just looks like a real ugly situation," Sleik said. "Unbelievable. I guess you don't expect this kind of thing to happen here. I guess you don't expect it anywhere."
Town of Birchwood Chairwoman Jimmie Dimick, who has lived in the community for 40 years, noted that residents refer to this period as "holy week" (because) everybody goes deer hunting."
"Especially for this part of the state, this doesn't happen," Dimick said of the shootings.
Wayne Blackdeer was tending bar at the Country Side Bar in Hayward when he heard about the incident from hunters stopping Sunday afternoon for drinks.
"People were talking about it," said Blackdeer, who listened to authorities on a police scanner call for backup.
"I heard them say four of (the hunters) were DOA and possibly a fifth" was dead on arrival, Blackdeer said.
The shootings were also the talk of the Cruz'in Bar in Hayward.
"Some hunters coming in said that there's somebody out in the woods that has just been shooting people," said bartender Jamie Stark.
An ambulance driver who dispatches out of Hayward was called to the scene west of Exeland in southern Sawyer County, but he said he ended not transporting anyone because there were enough ambulances to handle the victims.
The ambulance driver, who spoke on the condition his name not be used, said he was told five people were dead in the woods and authorities were not allowing anyone to go from the staging area, off of County Highway C and Deer Lake Road, to the crime scene in the woods about a mile away.
A helicopter was seen taking off with one of the victims about 4 p.m. Sunday.
Dave Weitz, a Department of Natural Resources spokesman based in Eau Claire, said several game wardens were assisting at the scene. Weitz has worked for the DNR for decades.
"I can't ever remember anything that sounds like this happening before," said Weitz.
Journal Sentinel reporter Tom Kertscher and The Associated Press contributed to this report
_________________
To Quote John Kerry in his concession speech. "But in an american election, there are no losers, because whether or not our candidates are successful, the next morning we all wake up as Americans
posted on November 22, 2004 07:36:15 AM new
It's a shame, Libra, so many turn to violence when they don't like something. Seemed to start out with road rage...and now it's infecting so many different areas of our lives.
Here we had the basketball players suspended for different periods of time because of their physical attacks on one another and the paying spectators. And these are supposed to be the one's our young people look up to and admire.
This case with these hunters is a big surprise to many, I'd bet. All these deaths over a chair in a tree.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on November 22, 2004 08:13:10 AM new
This was the most bizzare story I have seen in a long time. What a nut case. Kills five people and wounds three others because of a dispute over a tree stand.
This guy gets lost and winds up on private land and was asked to leave and then shoots these people. Unreal!
posted on November 22, 2004 08:42:25 AM new
linda says, """I've also wondered if the killer might be an animal activist supporter...who didn't want the deer shot."""'
Kind of a violent form of protest doncha think?
Besides he had a deer license and rifle, I THINK he was deer hunting.
posted on November 22, 2004 04:39:02 PM new
I have already asked Mark to "post" the area of my tree stand this year. Too many "non-locals" setting up camps. Four years ago, I was almost run over by one on a 4-wheeler (on posted land).
We can't believe this happened. The "shooter" was from out of state, so he had to have a non-resident license. He had to have been staying somewhere. There is definitely something wrong with this guy.
And with the basketball fiasco....Alot of fans were in on this. They should be held accountable as well. At the very least, barred from attending games. Kids might look up to sports "stars", but imagine the shock of seeing their fathers and uncles acting in such a manner on the local news.
posted on November 22, 2004 05:28:13 PM new
I agree with you, terryann, on both the fans being held responsible for their actions as well as the players and also on the poor examples being set by some parents at different sporting events.
It sounds like I'm the only one who read this killer hunted down the people he was fighting with and whom he wounded and killed. And those that were at the camp, who lived, might have only lived because he ran out of bullets.
crazy....
posted on November 22, 2004 11:49:36 PM new
linduh, you probably are the ONLY one """who read this killer hunted down the people he was fighting with """
because he DIDN'T.
He was not hunting them down...at least not according to the sheriff. He was walking away after shooting his first victim and then turned and started firing.
posted on November 23, 2004 08:45:44 AM new
While I'm sure the San Diego paper is a good source of news I watched a televised press conference with the LOCAL sheriff speaking. HE said that the man walked several yards from the other party, turned, and started shooting. That is NOT hunting them down, that is called shooting.
And the POINT of """"It sounds like I'm the only one who read this killer hunted down the people """""
is what?
And the award for most stupid non-sensical statement of the week goes to the loving christian Rev for.....
""""I believe in gun control for non US citizens.""""
Ya, right, American citizens NEVER use guns to kill each other............
posted on November 23, 2004 10:40:09 AM new
The shooter was a naturalized citizen, father of 6. It said in the paper he was an avid hunter.
According to the paper only 1 deer hunter was armed. The rest were in the deer shack, and when the hunter radioed the shack they jumped into their all terain vehicles and came to help them. One of the hunters killed was a teen age girl.
Another hunter has died....
Deer Season in Wisconsin is a special time when guys get together go to camp and enjoy a week or more of reuniting with old friends. That was a terrible thing that happened. The owner of the propery is someone that I knew when I worked in that area.
_________________
To Quote John Kerry in his concession speech. "But in an american election, there are no losers, because whether or not our candidates are successful, the next morning we all wake up as Americans
posted on November 23, 2004 11:43:14 AM new
Yes, the teenager, and I'd also heard a woman was one of those killed too. Such a tragic thing to have happen. oh...
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waving "HI" to Colin. Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours [in case I don't see you again between now and then.]
posted on November 23, 2004 04:31:20 PM new
On the news today the shooter now claims that the other people where shooting at him first and where using racial slurs against him.
Here we go again.... play that race card. This guy just makes me sick!
posted on November 23, 2004 04:57:11 PM new
Posted on Tue, Nov. 23, 2004
Suspect Says Hunters Shot at Him First
ROBERT IMRIE
Associated Press
HAYWARD, Wis. - A Hmong immigrant suspected of killing six fellow deer hunters in the Wisconsin woods told investigators that he opened fire after they took a shot at him first and hurled racial slurs at him, according to court papers filed Tuesday.
A judge set bail at $2.5 million for Chai Vang, 36, of St. Paul, Minn., who was jailed on suspicion of murder and attempted murder.
The shootings occurred Sunday after Vang climbed into a tree stand on private property and got into a confrontation with the landowner and members of his hunting party.
On Monday, authorities gave an account in which they made no mention of any of the victims taking the first shot. Instead, they said that after the other hunters told the trespasser to get out of the tree, Vang walked off, then wheeled and opened fire.
One of the witnesses, a hunter who was wounded in the shootings, gave a statement contradictory to Vang's. Lauren Hesebeck said a member of the hunting party shot at Vang only after he started firing at them, according to court documents.
A representative of Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager, who is prosecuting the case, said she would not comment on the documents.
Vang, an immigrant from Laos, was arrested about four hours after the shootings as he emerged from the woods with his empty semiautomatic rifle. Five people died in the woods; a sixth died Monday in a hospital. Two others were wounded.
Vang's account was included in court documents that were used to convince a judge that there was probable cause to hold him on suspicion of murder.
According to Vang's story, he got lost while hunting on public land and ended up in the vacant tree stand - a raised platform used by hunters to see deer and shoot down at them. Vang told investigators he did not realize he was on private property.
Landowner Terry Willers approached, asking why Vang was there and pointed out he was on private property. Vang said he told Willers he had not seen any "no trespassing" signs, climbed down from the stand and started to walk away. Authorities say Willers owns the land along with Robert Crotteau, one of the victims.
Vang said he heard Willers call on a walkie-talkie, and five or six men on all-terrain vehicles approached a few moments later. Vang said the group surrounded him, and some used racial slurs.
He said that he was told to get off the property, and as he started walking away, he turned back and saw Willers point a gun at him from about 100 feet away. He told investigators he immediately dropped to a crouch, and Willers shot at him, the bullet hitting the ground 30 to 40 feet behind Vang.
Vang said he removed the scope from his rifle and began firing, continuing to shoot as the group scattered. He said one of the victims, Joey Crotteau, tried to run away, but Vang chased him, got within 20 feet and shot him in the back. Crotteau, 20, was killed. Willers was wounded and was listed in fair condition Tuesday.
Vang said as he began to run, an ATV with two people drove past and he fired three or four times, causing both people to fall off the machine. He said that he looked up the trail, saw that one of the men was standing, yelled, "You're not dead yet?" and fired one more shot in the man's direction. He said he did not know if he hit the man or not.
Vang said he then ran away.
Authorities have said there was only one gun among the eight hunters.
There have been previous clashes between Southeast Asian and white hunters in the region. Hunters have complained the Hmong do not understand the concept of private property and hunt wherever they want. The tension once led to a fistfight in Minnesota, and a Hmong bow hunter in Wisconsin this fall reported having at least two white hunters point guns at him.
About 24,000 Hmong live in St. Paul, the highest concentration of any U.S. city. Hmong leaders condemned the shootings and offered condolences to victims' families.
"What happened in Wisconsin is in no way representative of the Hmong people and what they stand for," said Cha Vang, no relation to the suspect.
A Hmong leader in Wisconsin has advised Hmong hunters to skip the rest of the gun deer season because of the tensions. The season runs through Sunday.
"We don't know who will be thinking what. I just think it would be best to let people cool off," Joe Bee Xiong, director of the Eau Claire Area Hmong Mutual Assistance Association, told the Eau Claire Leader-Telegram.
New details about Vang began to emerge Tuesday.
Military records obtained by The Associated Press show that he spent six years in the California National Guard, and earned a sharpshooter qualification badge. But his primary role during his time in the Guard, from 1989 to 1995, involved clerical duties.
After his discharge, he spent two more years in the Individual Ready Reserve.
Dov Schwartz, an Army spokesman in Washington, said the sharpshooter qualification was "not an extraordinarily special thing."
Vang has no criminal record with the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension. Police in St. Paul said there had been two domestic violence calls to his home in the past year, but both were resolved without incident.
__________________________________
"The more I want to get something done, the less I call it work." - Richard Bach
[ edited by wgm on Nov 23, 2004 05:01 PM ]
posted on November 23, 2004 08:27:21 PM new
What's worse Democraps like Betty McCollum is bringing 15,000 of these people that we already don't have room or the money for.
And this guy is even trying the language barrier as an excuse. The sad thing is, being from the area, I see it everyday. And these people will get in front of a judge and use the language barrier excuse even though they speak english fluently and all that happens is a good finger shaking.
I hope the judge in this case has balls. The Hmong criminal in this case was shooting people in the back. Hardly self-defense. And cowfarm, next time you spew your crap here, at least get your facts correct.
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Alive in 2005
posted on November 23, 2004 10:56:47 PM new
"What's worse Democraps like Betty McCollum is bringing 15,000 of these people that we already don't have room or the money for."
The Hmong people earned the right to be in this country. It was promised by the United States Government. They should have came here long before they did.
They fought as Americans units in Laos. They were supported by American air power. They saved American pilots lives and wrapped their Dead bodies, brought them across the boarder into South Vietnam to be shipped home. They and the Hill people of South Vietnam were the killing fields.
This Republican Marine was glad to see General Vang Pao at the news conference.
posted on November 25, 2004 09:33:49 PM new
Update: This accuser is now being investigated for a 2001 deer hunting fatal shooting in a near by county. That shooting is unsolved. Evidently there are similarities with this shooting and that one.
What I find difficult to understand is Wisconsin has a blaze orange regulation and this hunter was hunting in campflouge.
_________________
To Quote John Kerry in his concession speech. "But in an american election, there are no losers, because whether or not our candidates are successful, the next morning we all wake up as Americans
posted on November 26, 2004 05:46:26 AM new
Libra - There was an article somewhere that stated the shooter did have his vest showing blaze orange before and during the shootings. It was after he shot the group that he turned his vest inside out. I may be wrong, but that's how I understood it.
edited to add: One of the articles I read stated he was wearing blaze orange when spotted and approached (I am guessing this account is from the sole survivor). One of the victims had written the shooter's hunting license # from his vest/jacket in the dust on one of the ATVs to file a complaint later. I would guess he turned the blaze orange inside to conceal his license number.
__________________________________
"The more I want to get something done, the less I call it work." - Richard Bach
[ edited by wgm on Nov 26, 2004 06:01 AM ]
posted on November 26, 2004 09:00:32 AM new
treestand hunting..there's an oxymoron if ever I've heard one...
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
posted on November 26, 2004 01:42:32 PM new
Profe, why do you think treestand hunting is an oxymoron?
Seems to me a very efficient way to get some venison.
Safe (most of the time) because everyone knows where everyone else is.
Bow hunters have a preplanned "clear shot" area and they can be much closer to the deer, both of these things cut down on wounding an animal.
Sometimes it's just kinda hard to run down those whitetails....they're pretty fast.
And in a dry fall it's impossible to sneak up on them with your Bowie knife because of 6 inches of LOUD leaves giving away your every move....we have trees with leaves up here, they come off in the autumn and rustle a lot.
crazy....
[ edited by Twelvepole on Nov 26, 2004 11:30 AM ]