posted on October 24, 2001 07:28:20 PM new
PaypalDamon, please help me. I just logged into my account to see that I have a $300+ payment being reversed on me. I have not received any emails from the buyer nor paypal, so I have no clue as to what the problem is. The package was fully insured and has delivery confirmation. Delivery confirmation shows that the package was in fact delivered a month ago.
PaypalDamon, is there a phone number or email that I can use to reach you to straighten this all out?
posted on October 24, 2001 09:15:34 PM new
I just got a reply to my email that I sent to the buyer regarding this "reversal" of payment. They say that they did not initiate any kind of chargeback and have no idea why paypal is doing this. They too just emailed paypal trying to get them to cancel this reversal. This person has very good eBay feedback and also sells quite a bit on eBay, so I dont think this is fraud nor a newbie mistake. While I am relieved that my buyer is helping me straighten this out, this leaves me more confused than ever. Why would Paypal reverse the funds out of my account when neither I nor my buyer have requested this?
posted on October 25, 2001 09:34:12 AM new
sherwik: Please email me at [email protected]
There are several sellers initiating a lawsuit over this. Paypal tells them buyer made a charge back and buyer denies doing it. One seller was told that dozens of his buyers did that, some of whom he knew personally and had been doing business with them for a long time (and still is, just not with PP). On another forum, there is a buyer complaining that after making several PP payments and paying her CC bill, her sellers are asking her why she charged them back. She didn't. It may be that PP has found a new way to keep operating in the face of heavy losses.
posted on October 25, 2001 10:26:20 AM new
Hi
I have same problem in my PayPal account.
I have two chargebacks in my account, all were eBay auction for cell phone. one was credit card payment, I shipped to verified address with FedEx, and another was PayPal fund instant transfer. Two transitions were one and half year ago, after over one year, PayPal stole my money from my account and restricted my account. I spoke with PayPal CSR-very rude, it not help, terrible PayPal!
As an FYI, chargebacks are processed because the credit card company submits it to us. Yisgood's information is totally incorrect.
Hi supergsm,
Most card companies allow 60 days to file a chargeback on the consumer's end. The processing time can take several months to get to us, but that seems exceptional. I would be very surprised if you received notification of a chargeback that old. Can you please send me the information?
posted on October 25, 2001 11:23:44 AM new
>>Yisgood's information is totally incorrect<<
A BUYER just emailed me a copy of her Paypal transaction log showing many (but not all) of her transactions reversed. So I guess it's one of three things:
1) Paypal screwed up.
2)If we are to believe Pope-pal, they are infallible and anything that happens is always the account holder's fault. This buyer actually did charge back numerous transactions and is now lying about it (why she would lie about it to me, since I am not at all involved, is a good question). But this still leaves another question unanswered. Why did Paypal let her keep using her account if she was defrauding so many people? So once again we come to: Paypal screwed up.
3) She completely made it up and forged the transaction log because, as Paypal would have us believe, there are thousands of people with nothing better to do than make up negative stories about Paypal. These liars include the Wall St Journal, Bankrate, Salon Magazine, Cnet and others. I guess Sherwik's buyer who claims not to have charged back the transaction is one of these liars as well.
posted on October 25, 2001 03:18:55 PM new
This is rich. A user asks Damon for help and Yisgood rides up to the rescue offering to help the poster contact a lawyer.
posted on October 25, 2001 04:00:14 PM new
It looked only as yisgood was attempting to help someone who had a problem. I hope yisgood does not feel intimidate by the post concerning "Yisgood rides up to the rescue". I feel yisgood should be respected and not put down by another poster. The issue at hand was a $300.00+ payment being reversed.
Oh well.
[ edited by bburd51 on Oct 25, 2001 04:01 PM ]
[ edited by bburd51 on Oct 25, 2001 04:28 PM ]
posted on October 25, 2001 04:40:55 PM new
>>I'm sorry I forgot to consider the noble aspects of ambulance chasing. <<
I guess telling folks that they are protected against charge backs after it has been proven numerous times that this isn't true is noble. I guess accepting payments into restricted accounts so that neither the seller nor the payer has access to the money is noble. I guess accepting payments from stolen credit cards which you did a lousy job validating, taking fees for this, then making the recipient pay for your incompetence and KEEPING THE FEES is noble. I guess riding to the rescue of this "noble" organization is also noble.
I guess warning folks that they might become the victim of these practices is "ambulance chasing."
At least you admit that using paypal might lead to the need for an ambulance.
To those who aren't wearing a pair of paypal $5 blinders: This post makes the THIRD seller who has reported getting a paypal charge back that the buyer claims not to have made. On another forum just today, a BUYER reported that some of her Paypal transactions were charged back even though she was billed by her credit card and paid them. So I guess if Paypal is to be believed, the credit card companies have joined in this big conspiracy to make Paypal look bad. Is there anyone on the planet aside from Uaru who isn't part of this conspiracy?
posted on October 25, 2001 04:53:42 PM new
yisgood,
I'm sorry that I considered your contacting the poster and assiting them on getting legal council before they ever talked to Damon to be low-life, underhanded, sleazy, leecherous, and other unsavory things.
Have you considered supplying a link where anyone making a request to Damon can fill out a complaint for your legal team to investigate?
I think it is a great thing you are doing, Damon can take his advise and assitance elsewhere as 'yisgood to the rescue' will give any seeking help contacts to legal representation.
posted on October 25, 2001 05:02:33 PM new
Hi yisgood,
Again, chargebacks are only processed because the credit card company has submitted it. Have you considered the fact that a husband may have called about a charge that his wife made on a shared card?
The only time where there has been a problem was the item I mentioned (16 users impacted due to a processing error by our processing agent). All impacted customers were taken care of when they received notification of a chargeback that shouldn't have been there.
There are many variables to running a payment service (or any service for that matter). Not all mistakes are the mistakes of the company, nor are all mistakes the fault of the consumer. All situations, however, can be rectified.
posted on October 25, 2001 05:11:06 PM new
So which is it?
"Pending reversals/chargebacks occur if:
a) credit card company reports a chargeback
b) buyer files a buyer complaint
That's it."
or
"The only time where there has been a problem was the item I mentioned (16 users impacted due to a processing error by our processing agent). All impacted customers were taken care of when they received notification of a chargeback that shouldn't have been there."
-------------------------
Yisgood keep up the good work.
dendude
posted on October 25, 2001 05:12:53 PM new
>>I'm sorry that I considered your contacting the poster and assiting them on getting legal council before they ever talked to Damon to be low-life, underhanded, sleazy, leecherous, and other unsavory things.<<
And Damon's response to this user and the other with the identical problem that it couldn't have happened, before he even investigated is noble? I have called the customer service of other companies and I have never had them make a determination before they even looked at it.
Has Damon ever admitted that the infallible Pope-pal erred? He gave the same answer here that he gave to another posted with the identical problem on the other board. Basically, "it didnt happen. if it did, it's not paypal's fault." Since Paypal will never admit there is a problem and will continue to maintain that they are safe in spite of all the posts to the contrary, someone has to inform scammed users that they are not alone.
Have you considered supplying a link where anyone making a request to Damon can fill out a complaint for your legal team to investigate?
I do get a lot of paypal complaints via email. After reading the details, I inform most of them that the fault was not Paypal's. But there are some that I can't see any other way. In view of the others who have reported the same problem and Damon's non-answer, I believe that this is one of them. Of the 100 or so folks who wanted me to put them in touch with the attorney, I only passed three of them on.
>>I think it is a great thing you are doing, Damon can take his advise and assitance elsewhere as 'yisgood to the rescue' will give any seeking help contacts to legal representation.<<
I never said that Damon's assistance was useless. In fact, I have stated the opposite on many occasions. But even you have to recognize that he can never go against the company line. As many posts here indicate, sometimes the problem IS paypal and in those cases Damon will never be able to admit it.
posted on October 25, 2001 05:19:37 PM new
Damon: With all due respect because I understand your difficult position as what I consider to be Paypal's entire customer service department, it is now close to a year since a Paypal spokesman promised me that paypal would institute a hotline directly to someone who can handle large charge back issues and restricted accounts. The recurring theme on all these posts is:
- paypal did not inform the user about the charge back or restricted account
- the user had to call, fax and email repeatedly. Calls were not returned. Promised actions were not taken.
- different paypal CS people gave conflicting explanations of what happened, including statements that directly contradicted the TOU on the site.
What is so difficult about sending an email saying "Your account was restricted because of ----. Please call our hotline at --- so we can correct this problem." ? And then have someone at that hotline who can do more than say "the guy in charge is out to lunch and doesnt have a phone. Leave a message and we might get back to you in a few months."
posted on October 25, 2001 06:15:25 PM new
Gee, I'm not sure that saying, "I'm sorry" and "to be low-life, underhanded, sleazy, leecherous, and other unsavory things" in the same sentence could possibly lead to a civil conversation. Anyway, back to the $300.00+ payment being reversed topic.
posted on October 25, 2001 06:30:57 PM new
Hi Damon,
You do an admirable job, it can't easy. In this thread you've said:
"Pending reversals/chargebacks occur if:
a) credit card company reports a chargeback
b) buyer files a buyer complaint
That's it."
In this same thread you've said:
"The only time where there has been a problem was the item I mentioned (16 users impacted due to a processing error by our processing agent). All impacted customers were taken care of when they received notification of a chargeback that shouldn't have been there."
It would seem that the second statement contradicts the first.
dendude
posted on October 27, 2001 10:51:32 AM new
From Damon to me:
Hi invisigoth,
Chargebacks/pending reversals occur because:
a) credit card company reported the chargeback to us, which we began processing
b) buyer files a Buyer Complaint
These are the reasons why reversals are placed on transactions. Please feel free to send me the information to [email protected].
From me to Damon et al:
Hello Damon,
Thank you for responding. I look forward to having this resolved. In response to your list, neither of the two conditions apply. I will contact you via email.
~invisigoth
An added note:
yisgood bashing
As a new participant to the boards, I am learning that some bashing goes on. Everyone reading these posts has an equal opportunity to post messages to help others. To say one answers a post before someone else had a chance is ridiculous considering the forum (a public meeting place for open discussion).
Thank you yisgood and Damon for your interest in helping me.
posted on October 27, 2001 04:14:45 PM new
Damon repeatedly implies that PayPal has nothing to do with the chargeback process - when in fact PayPal is supposed to dispute the chargebacks on behalf of its customers.
* * *
Yisgood's statements always seem straightforward and open. Damon's statements are often specious.
posted on October 27, 2001 04:20:01 PM new
Hi walhalla,
The comment is not contradictory. I stated the reasons chargebacks occur,yet I advised clarified that there was a processing error once---this processing error impacted 16 users and was corrected.
The chargebacks are issued by the credit card companies. We simply process them based on the information received.
posted on October 27, 2001 06:13:13 PM new
So I guess if Paypal is to be believed, the credit card companies have joined in this big conspiracy to make Paypal look bad.
Rumor has it Oliver Stone will be directing the "paypal conspiracy" real soon. The plot of the story starts with visa, mastercard, the better business bureau, cheated customers, and members of a messageboard trying to ruin a perfect company with a not so perfect record. Will some cheerleaders save the day? Stay Tuned............
posted on November 13, 2001 06:12:35 PM new
Hi chum,
No, what I am saying is that we receive chargebacks from the credit card companies. Chargebacks are filed by their customers, or reported to us because the card was used fraudulently.
All I am advising is that chargebacks come in from these actions. The processing error that I mentioned (16 users) was corrected, and would be if another were to be found (an outside vendor processes these back to us).
posted on November 13, 2001 08:46:09 PM new
usps delivery confirmation is useless if you want to prove you have delivered the item,as all it shows is that it has arrived at your customer's post office and scanned at their machine.it is good for tracking to see if it has arrived that far.
as for proof of delivery,if the postman placed it in the wrong box and the neighbor took it,the customer will never know.
