posted on February 16, 2002 08:29:15 PM new
On 1/26/02 my PayPal was hacked (no, I did NOT give out my password or click thru any other link) and 4 payments totalling $2,950 were made from my checking and debit card. I immediately called and emailed PayPal. A couple days later they finally got around to telling me I'd have to file an affidavit and police report. I sent all the information they requested and got a return receipt proving they received it. I have emailed Damon several times asking to speak to their Fraud/Investigation Dept., but he claims he "doesn't have access" to that phone number or email address, but that he would "forward my email" to them. Hmmm ... Damon, how can you forward it if you don't have their address? I wonder if there even IS a fraud department? There certainly is no "customer service".
Anyways, I did some investigating on my own and supplied PayPal with the name, address, and phone number of one of the people that received a $1500 payment from my account. I have also been in contact with SIX other people who have been defraud this same way and because of the email domains I am sure it is the same person. But will PayPal TALK to me or even email me? Heck no!!! The only thing I've heard from PayPal is a canned letter saying they've now restricted my account because *I* owe them $1500 because my bank returned their draft for a transaction I never authorized.
This hacker has been running rampant thru PayPal since at least October and is still going strong. PayPal has done NOTHING to stop him/her/them and it makes me ask WHY???
I was an avid PayPal user, thinking something like this could never happen to me. Boy, was I wrong! And now that I've seen PayPal's "customer service" (what a joke!), I have nothing good to say about them.
posted on February 16, 2002 09:56:16 PM new
Shelia,
I didn't have my account hacked but I have several thousand dollars restricted in an account because of a "suspicious" transaction. Its been almost a month and they still haven't been able to tell me any details of what happened. If Paypal doesn't address your problem you can file a complaint with the FTC and if you had your money invested in the Money Market account when the funds were illegally sent from your account then you should be able to take advantage of the clause in the Fund Prospectus which says that Paypal will only redeem shares for transactios that you have authorized but of course its no guarantee but at least you could file another complaint with the SEC. If they still don't fix your problem ,and they aren't quick about it, then you can get some more help at "www.paypalwarning.com". Paypal claims to deal with customer problems promptly and maybe they do but it is evident that they are not nearly as good at it as larger financial firms.
I think the real problem is that Paypal has focused on attracting "Any user" instead of maintaining reasonable standards and screening the waters. Very few other companies have generated the amount of angst that Paypal has in its customer base. All one has to do is look at major banks and other financial institions, they may not always deal with customers well and they may freeze accounts when instructed to by law but they don't freeze accounts arbitrarily, and they know not to let an irrate customer stew because irrate customers get on TV, and because the amount of cost the bank might have to absorb for that one customer pays for itself in maintaining the public image that it is a sound financial instition otherwise they could lose millions of dollars in closed bank accounts because of the fear generated from one news special. Paypal doesn't just have one irrate customer, one only has to look at it statistically to see that Paypal has thousands of "irrate" customers. Are some of these customers at fault, yes, but I would venture that most of these customers are victims of the same fraud that Paypal has claimed to be trying to prevent. Paypal would go a long way to gaining the confidence of these customers if it would simply be more forth coming once a customer has proven who they are. There is no valid reason to stonewall a victimized customer once they have faxed their drivers license, bank statement, and electric bill, to do so is insult to injury. Paypal should also do everything possible to extend the protections they advertise to customers, who have had no problems in the past and are clearly innocent victims. Informing someone who has just been scammed that they are not covered is just throwing gas on the fire and it makes the whole idea of insurance look phoney. If a seller says he or she shipped something and they provide a tracking number and don't have a history of complaints concerning no shipment of goods then be reasonable and take his or her statements at face value acting like the individual is a criminal because they were scammed is ridiculous. Maybe my idea of customer service is unrealistic but I know one thing and that is that if Paypal doesn't start setting up some real preventative barriors to fraud at the front door and continues focus on flexibility that serves the criminal community more than the legitament buyers and sellers then they will not last. Bigger have fallen for less.
posted on February 17, 2002 01:43:04 AM new
Sheila,
I know how you feel. I was scammed by a fraudulent seller and PayPal did absolutely nothing to help me resolve the problem. They didn't return my emails and even hung up on me when I called their customer service number. I had done at least $20,000 worth of business through them and they treated me like I didn't even exist. They have made it abundantly clear that they wish to do nothing about the seller who scammed myself and 10 other people out of around $2500. I'm sure he is still out there opening new accounts and starting new scams. I have closed my PayPal account and will never do business with them or anyone affiliated with them again. If they want to harbor this fraudulent seller and let him continue to cost them members then that just goes to show what their priorities are. I urge anyone who might be considering PayPal to do some research on their background before making a grave mistake.
posted on February 17, 2002 04:28:39 AM new
Sheila
EXACTLY the same thing happened to me I had $2500 in my paypal account and somone hacked in and wiped it out.
I had to file a police report etc. I did get my money back however it took 90 days and the threat of legal action.
Needless to say I will never use them ever again and closed my account.
Good luck Marc
posted on March 8, 2002 12:16:49 PM new
Well here it is Day #41 and STILL no response from PayPal. And I know Damon is reading these threads cuz he's posted to several lately. He's just ignoring the rest of us. But I'd be hiding too if I worked for PayPal.
Because of PayPal's silence, I'm beginning to believe (like others do) that this hacking was an inside job. Why else would they have nothing to say about it and ignore all correspondence?
mrfoxy76 ... will you email me please? [email protected]
[ edited by Sheila12 on Mar 8, 2002 04:29 PM ]
posted on March 8, 2002 09:57:26 PM new
If I worked for PayPal I would wear a bulletproof vest everyday. You never know when a crazy person who has been screwed by PayPal might see you somewhere. When a company like PayPal screws with peoples livelihoods you never know when a disgruntled ex-member might just go off.
posted on March 10, 2002 08:01:34 AM new
You could sue them in small claims court. File the police report and then sue them. Companies like Paypal define success and failure according to the bottom line. They aren't going to do anything until you press alot harder.
posted on March 13, 2002 08:15:07 PM new
UPDATE...
I received an email from PayPal today (46 days after reporting my account was compromised/hacked. They FINALLY finished their "investigation" and have returned the $1,450 to my credit card (which is actually a Visa debit card).
BUT ... that account is closed. I emailed them and (believe it or not) received a response within minutes. Unbelieveable!!! They say once they receive the rejection from my bank they will mail me a check.
Looks like this is finally coming to an end, altho it ain't over till the fat lady sings! Until I receive the check AND it clears my bank, I won't be holding my breath.
As far as PayPal is concerned, altho it appears I will be getting my money back, I still say they have the most sorriest excuse for "customer service" than I've ever seen.
you said that you finally received an email from paypal saying that your money would be returned. What was the email address on that email? I'm desperate to contact someone, anyone, a live human being who can help me. My account's been frozen for no reason and they won't respond to any of my requests for help. If you could just tell me who sent you that email, that'd be helpful. Thanks so much!
I personally wouldn't waste my time contacting Damon. He's good on the boards at being "helpful" (AKA quoting policy and offering to graciously forward your emails) ... but that's all he's good for. I have not once received any actual help from him.
I can't say for sure WHY PayPal suddenly decided to finish their investigation and return my funds, but try these steps...
Write to this lady at Travelers Insurance ... [email protected] ... Travelers insures PayPal users' funds against fraud, etc. Altho Travelers will tell you that you will have to file a claim thru PayPal (and we all know what good THAT does!), she forwarded my complaint to [email protected], Attn: Artie. I wrote to "Artie" too but never received a reply, altho the next day their investigation was complete.
Also, try emailing [email protected] ... that is the ONLY email address I've ever received a human response from. Again, once I wrote to that email addy my account was resolved the very next day.
I also called PayPal (1-888-221-1161) Tuesday night. It takes forever on hold before a real person answers (geez, wonder why???) but don't take any crap off them. I was "accidently" disconnected the first 3 times I called. The fourth time I told the guy these calls weren't costing me a cent and that I had nothing better to do all night than to stay on the phone with them. Tell them you want to talk to a manager. They will say management doesn't accept incoming calls but that you will get a call back the next day. I never received a call (BIG surprise!), but then again the very next day their investigation was complete!
I also had given an interview to an online magazine about my problems getting any help with PayPal. This magazine contacted PayPal so that may have gotten them off their duff too.
If there's anything I can do to help, let me know! (That goes for anyone else too!) ... [email protected]
posted on March 15, 2002 03:44:54 PM new
Hi Sheila12,
I actually had your case looked at again. The delay was caused (based on what I got back from customer service) by the information being sent to the wrong fax number.
The other method of affidavit submission was received on the 13th of this month. Another factor leading to a delay was your contacting the bank to stop one transaction, which led to an account restriction.
Unfortunately, you kind of got caught up in a transitionary phase.
My sincerest apologies for the delay. It also appears that the communication from CS wasn't as solid as it could have been.
posted on March 15, 2002 04:50:14 PM new
Wrong fax number??? Sorry, but that's a pretty lame excuse considering I never faxed a single thing!!!
What "other method of affidavit submission" are you talking about that was received the 13th of this month??? I sent ONE affidavit to PayPal and you received that on February 11th. It was sent certified mail and I have the green card showing it was received then. If you are talking about the email I received from PayPal asking the same questions that were in the affidavit I sent back by certified mail, I received that March 12th at 9:54pm and returned it by email 35 minutes later.
And third, this delay is now MY fault because I stopped payment on a $1500 draft from my checking account??? This hacker drained my checking AND debit card ... what the heck did you expect me to do in the meantime until you got around to "investigating"???
And if you don't mind me asking (altho I doubt I'll get an answer) ... why have you been avoiding me all these weeks on the forums and suddenly decide to start communicating now?
posted on March 15, 2002 05:30:53 PM new
RE: Damon's comment: "Unfortunately, you kind of got caught up in a transitionary phase". O M G!!! That's definately a new one!! Then again Sheila, I suppose that's probably your fault too!! LOL!! What were you (paypal) transitioning into Damon? What, did someone move cubicles? YOUR B.S. ANSWERS ARE TOO MUCH!!
Admit it! You completely ignored her, while responding to others in the same threads, on the same days she was asking you questions. But now (that her problem is solved) you're trying to save face, so you blame it on HER and Customer Service? It never ends!
Well now, there's a company that cares about it's customers!
posted on March 15, 2002 06:24:03 PM new
Oh no, my problem is definitely not solved. PayPal SAID they would send me a check. I don't have it yet and until I do (AND it clears my bank), I don't consider this matter closed.
FURTHERMORE ... What the hell does PayPal think they're doing giving out information about MY account to other people??? An editor from a magazine called PayPal and was told the investigation on my account was complete and they had returned $1,450 to my credit card. That was NOT PayPal's place to release ANY information to ANYONE but ME!!! Now explain to me about "confidentiality" and your need to "protect your users." PayPal refuses to divulge any information they have on hackers and scammers, but happily gives out information on the victims. For 2-cents (and no I do NOT accept payment of that thru PayPal) I'm tempted to file charges on ethics.
posted on March 18, 2002 10:10:24 AM new
Well, that being said (that your troubles are NOT over) - I'm sure Damon just went back into hiding (from you).
And I agree with you about them providing info... What was it they kept telling Dealerjim?... "Before we can release ANY information, you'll need to obtain an subpoeana". All I can figure is that they're scared of the press, and not forward thinking enough to realize that giving them too much information isn't good either. gl.
posted on March 18, 2002 11:06:25 AM new
What a coward!!! Damon sure jumped in here quick enough when he said "I actually had your case looked at again." But now he's back to hiding because he can't answer my question about giving out my personal information with a quote from their TOS.
Damon ... Did the editor that called you actually present you with a subpoena??? If not, please supply me with the quote from your TOS that says it's okay to release personal information about MY account to ANYONE.
Personally, I'm getting a little fed up with Damon's "selective responses".
posted on March 20, 2002 04:17:48 PM new
Hey Damon ... could you have them "look at my account again" and find out why I STILL don't have my money back???
Also ... you never answered me as to why PayPal feels free to give out MY account information to anyone who calls.
And Damon ... I know you're monitoring these boards. Don't say you had the day off ... I see you posted over at the ebay forums.
posted on March 21, 2002 07:10:58 PM new
Damon, this little game you're playing has gotten real old real quick. Keep ignoring me all you want cuz I will NOT go away. You have answered other posts on this forum but again completely ignore me. So go ahead and keep ignoring ... it shows everyone the kind of "service" I'm used to receiving from PayPal. And trust me when I say there are MANY others who read these forums who do not post.
Again I ask ... What is PayPal's policy on giving out information on accounts? A magazine editor called PayPal and was told the investigation on my account was complete and $1,450 had been credited to my credit card. If I called and said I was an editor, could I get information on other accounts? Why can't I get info on my own account, yet PayPal feels free to give it to someone else???
And by the way ... I STILL don't have my money back. As I said, I closed that account so it's impossible to "credit" it. I was basically told "the check's in the mail." And if anyone believes that, I'm the Queen of England.
So go ahead and keep ignoring me ... but just remember, sometimes your silence speaks louder than words.
posted on March 30, 2002 04:47:20 AM new
After almost 2 months, my money has been returned. PayPal got REAL cooperative towards the end and I even GOT phone calls from them. I even got the direct phone number to "Jessica" ... not real sure what her position is but seems like she was some kind of supervisor in Customer Service. Perhaps some of you could speak to her about your problems ... 402-935-2165. Oops, maybe I'm not supposed to post that on a public forum board. Damon, if you let me know this is not okay, let me know and I'll certainly put it on my list of things to take care of (of course it may take me 10, 30, 35, 45 or more days to do it).
You guys all have to read PayPal's public responses to an online magazine article written about my problems with them. Statements like "Most PayPal customers receive prompt and satisfactory help within 24 hours". Yeah right. Now they're trying to fight one of the class-action lawsuits saying "free account users" are supposed to use email only to settle their accounts and not call (that's why their phone number isn't displayed online). They had $2,950 of my money and expected me to sit and wait for one of their canned email responses?
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,90404,00.asp
I read on another thread here that Damon said he was "so busy" and that because this forum seemed rather "combative" he didn't bother posting here much. Damon seemed to have a free minute when he thought my problem was resolved (he jumped right in and said he had my account looked at again ... I'm sure my money was returned because of his diligent efforts <sarcastic grin> but STILL has not answered my question about why PayPal's TOS clearly state they will let you know the results of their investigation MAY take up to 45 days, but if it does they will give you use of your funds in 10 days.
posted on March 30, 2002 06:54:27 AM new
When you ask PayPal to get your money back, Damon is “so busy” and all PayPal’s staffs are busy as well. When you praise him, he suddenly has free minute to post response!
posted on April 9, 2002 06:34:48 PM new
Hell, I wouldn't hang out around here, why would he? =)
I love companies that refuse to hand you off to a higher manager. Imation is like that, too. They had only one mystical, magical "supervisor", and she was always in a meeting.
Of course, they also have a 4-hour average turnaround time on e-mails, answered any question they were given to the best of their knowledge, and actually called back when they said they would.
but STILL has not answered my question about why PayPal's TOS clearly state they will let you know the results of their investigation MAY take up to 45 days, but if it does they will give you use of your funds in 10 days. 