posted on February 11, 2003 04:40:22 PM new
Item 15.2 of the 11 page User agreement states "Credit Report. You agree that PayPal MAY order and review your credit report" for assessing your fitness to hold a PayPal account or ability to use the Service.
The Key word is "MAY". Anyone who plugs their Social Security number into a computer is setting themselves up for theft.
I think this is for any future Paypal user. One would assume that you are Grandfathered at this point.
If they request SS# there will be a major bailout of Paypal members. Any business with "good" credit most likely has a Merchant account with the card companies.
What made Paypal and created their success was the fact that they are a third party service not a credit granting venue. You can't run credit checks on people who are not using credit.
Also under law we are not required to provide SS# to anyone other than certain government agencies. The fact that everyone gives away their rights when they throw around their SS# is their problem.
Doesn't anyone know who BIG BROTHER is? Someone spell it out, he's not a relative.
posted on February 11, 2003 04:51:53 PM new
Thanks Greengate I knew I had seen that there. I surely won't give my SS#, and if enforced, I won't be taking PayPal I guess
I joined when they first opened, however, I just accepted there new terms when I logged into my account today, I read through, but I think too fast, it didn't seem to want to let me proceed to my account unless I clicked agree or disagree
Thanks!
Art Bell Retired! George Noory is on late night coasttocoastam.com
posted on February 12, 2003 06:27:59 AM new
I just read a few areas completely. Did I read it correctly!?! They are not responsible for fraud, robbery and theft...even if it is due to THEIR negligence????
2.6 Limit of Liability. IN NO EVENT SHALL WE, OUR PARENT, SUBSIDIARIES, EMPLOYEES OR OUR SUPPLIERS BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICE, OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE)
Did they also put all kinds of provisions in there making you agree to give up ALL your consumer rights except what they want?????
you waive California Civil Code §1542, which says: "A general release does not extend to claims which the creditor does not know or suspect to exist in his favor at the time of executing the release, which if not known by him must have materially affected his settlement with the debtor."
.................................................
Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, Firemen, Police. We call them our heroes...but we pay them like chumps
posted on February 12, 2003 06:56:06 AM new
Noticed the new terms today. I didn't see to much to worry about but.... Knowing Ebay, I know it's time to find another Service. BTW I've been with Pay Pal since the beginning and never had a problem with it.
I just had a First time buyer win the bid on a laptop (older unit) worked find. Ran a scan and defrag just before I shipped it. It was cheap and well worth the price she paid. She E-mailed me, first, that she needed a password to get into the computer. I told her to leave it empty and hit the return. Next, a week or so later, she tells me the hard drive is bad and she's had it checked by a computer expert and wanted to return it. I told her to send me a note from a certified computer Tech and I would take it back and refund her money. Never heard anything after that.
The problem is, buyer remorse. It's not what they really wanted or they find something else.
I can see more problems arising. The SS# is a problem too.
Amen,
Reverend Colin
posted on February 12, 2003 06:59:34 AM new
NearTheSea,
Look closer before you act. The social security number isn't a requirment for basic PayPal usage, it is an optional requirement and it isn't anything new, it's been around for a long time.
Before PayPal's going to let you make large withdrawals they want 2 things.
Credit Card
Verified Bank Account
Social Security Number
Any 2 of those 3 items satisfies their requirment.
posted on February 12, 2003 08:31:19 AM new
i agree,no one forces us to use paypal.
some folks want the cake and eat it too,more and more ebay bidders use paypal to make payment so we sellers see the aadvantage of accepting paypal.
paypal is still cheaper than having your own merchant account.
if you want to guard your ss,your bank account number,dont want uncle sam,ex spouse or business partner know you have a paypal balance or from your paypal account trace to other activities,then dont use paypal.simple and very simple.
on the subject of wanting the cake and eat it to,the buyer wants the low price from individual seller and expect the service and quality of bestbuy and compusa.
posted on February 13, 2003 12:17:53 PM new
>>> quote: As far as CC goes, how many people use american express or discover cards to make a purchase thru paypal? The reason I bring this up is that on paypals site they do not state the fact that anyone using those cards can not do a chargeback via paypal as those cards consider this a cash advance and not a purchase unlike mastercard or visa.
This was an merchant agreement negotiated between paypal and discover/amex. <<<
not true, at least not 2 or 3 months ago, i made 2 chargebacks with amex vs paypal transactions.
They consider that you are paying Paypal for a service. If that service is given (the funds are sent to where you instructed), you can not charge it back. Visa and Mastercard consider that you are making a purchase and if you do not receive what you ordered you can charge it back.
posted on February 15, 2003 05:47:44 PM new
Has anyone bothered to look at the new agreement? What trai said in her opening statement - Pay pal will now support buyers remorse leaving the auction seller up the creek - was wrong
Where in the new user agreement does it say that.
The following paragraph was taken directly from Paypal's TOS:
If your claim involves receiving not-as-described goods, we suggest using an online-trackable shipping service if you choose to return the goods to the seller. Please be aware that though you are not covered for not-as-described claims under this Buyer Complaint Policy, using an online-trackable shipping service may help you in working directly with the seller to resolve the problem. We also encourage you to file claims with us as you feel necessary for not-as-described merchandise. We will pass your complaint on to the seller and keep track of the claims for fraud control purposes.
No where above does it say paypal will refund money to the buyer. It says the buyer can ship the item back to the seller and to use a tracking number. It says in plain English not as described claims are not covered under the Buyer Complaint Policy.
I stopped using paypal a year ago. I agree with the others that have said If you dont like paypal dont use it. Nobody is forcing you to use their service.
Funny that is what I have recently done with ebay and it has made my life a lot less stressful.
"An Army of One"
[ edited by logansdad on Feb 15, 2003 05:54 PM ]
posted on February 15, 2003 06:52:17 PM new
in the past ,paypal has missed out the opportunities of making more discount fee because it does not get involved in quality/content issue.
so now here is the big chance ,the gate is open,for big spenders to use paypal .
posted on February 15, 2003 07:13:31 PM new
First off, my user name just like myself is
male We also encourage you to file claims with us as you feel necessary for not-as-described merchandise. We will pass your complaint on to the seller and keep track of the claims for fraud control purposes.
They will now force this down the sellers throat. Any buyer can now claim "not as described" excuse and even sent this to paypal.[goods]
This leaves this wide open for bidders remorse...read abuse. No matter what you want to call this, this is what it comes down to.
Paypal has always said that they do not get involved in this kind of dispute, well they do now!
From PayPal's Perspective:
a) we do not get involved in merchandise quality disputes (the only issue where we would really get involved is when a chargeback comes in and you still have the merchandise)
b) our Buyer Complaint Process does not guarantee recovery from a seller you have had an issue with
c) only one of the transactions was based off of a credit card, which you charged back. The other transaction was from a PayPal balance (much like sending the seller cash,money order, or check---it is up to you to attempt recovery now)
The old TOS does not cover quality not as described issue. The new TOS does offer the Buyer remorse option.
Its easy to say "just dont use it", but one is just about forced to due to bidder demand.
posted on February 15, 2003 08:25:41 PM new
this is true,easyto say dont have to use paypal but when you see these emails keep coming,how can you say no paypal??
whatever happens to that guy who was in a lawsuit and he comes to post on this board with a moses holding 2 tabernacles saying no paypal??
but may be a seller can list under 2 id,one takes paypal and one does not?/
posted on February 16, 2003 07:30:43 AM new
Jaded? NO. I see fine. And, again, your
eBay user ID is... There are just a few of
us who, like you, want to make sure we don't
do business with people we think are jerks.
---
"Cannot say. Saying, I would know. Do not
know, so cannot say". -- Zathras (Babylon 5)
