posted on February 25, 2003 04:21:00 PM new
Does anyone know what the appoximate age of this brooch might be? I'm thinking 1920's? It has a c-clasp and I think the Scarab is Carnelian. The red enameling looks pink in the photo. The colors are bright and the metal (or brass, cannot tell which one it is) is in excellent condition. I'm hoping it's not a new pin. It is heavy. Thanks!
Cheryl
[ edited by CBlev65252 on Feb 25, 2003 04:26 PM ]
posted on February 25, 2003 04:36:28 PM new
Hi CBlev65252 do a search on e-bay for a winged scarab pin there are 2 on ebay right now that are close to what you have...hope this helps
posted on February 27, 2003 11:48:13 AM new
1980's, Tutankhamen Revival.
There was a huge craze for Egyptian jewelry then, because there was a famous travelling exhibition of treasures from Tutankhamen's tomb. Lots of reproductions from that era.
The C-clasp is NOT NOT NOT indicative of age. I wish you folks would stop trying to date things by the clasp. It's not a definitive indicator. Use some common sense. The metal is bright, colors are fresh. YES! It is of recent origin. 80 year old brass would have some oxidation.
Go look at some genuinely old pieces of jewelry and you will see what I mean.
--
Because of their courage and daring and idealism, we will miss them all the more. --George W. Bush, 02/01/03
posted on February 27, 2003 01:46:14 PM new
Fluffy......"I wish you folks would stop trying to date things by the clasp. It's not a definitive indicator. Use some common sense"
Geez...it was just a question......
[ edited by cramer on Feb 27, 2003 01:47 PM ]
posted on February 27, 2003 02:04:48 PM new
Thanks, Cramer. I thought that was a bit rough, too. Anyway, I said I didn't know if it was brass or not AND it photographed lighter than it is because of the flash. Could also be that someone cleaned it before I got it. Who knows, anything is possible.
posted on February 27, 2003 02:27:00 PM new
Read the other "identify this jewelry" threads here and maybe you'll get fed up, too.
You people are always searching for FORMULAS to identify objects you bought without knowing anything about them. The clasp-type formula is particularly insidious since it sounds so authoritative and has been promulgated by a self-identified authority on jewelry (Kristie Romero). Common sense will tell you that any jewelry manufacturer can put any type of clasp they want on a piece at any time.
Other formulas (like "Made in England" versus "England" backstamps on china) are just as bad since the brain seems to shut down once it encounters a formula. So you get a plate with an "England" backstamp that also says "Dishwasher Safe", listed on eBay as dating from 1890.
What I find particularly disturbing about the identify-this threads is that if someone points out that the object is probably not what the owner devoutly wishes it to be, they are shouted down. We antiquers have long known that when someone asks an object about a question, the only answer they will accept is that 1) it's very old, and 2) it's worth a lot of money. We don't argue, as there is no point.
--
Because of their courage and daring and idealism, we will miss them all the more. --George W. Bush, 02/01/03
posted on February 27, 2003 02:38:54 PM new
fluffy - I am not disputing your expertise nor am I shouting "foul." I bought the pin because I LIKE THE PIN and for no other reason. I was just curious. Both my brother and his long time partner are antique dealers and jewelers (his partner being an orientalia specialist). If I really thought it was something, I'd take it to them. But, just because some of us aren't experts and come here to find out some more information (like you gave me and that is appreciated), doesn't mean we have to be treated like information-seeking idiots for it.
I know perfectly well that the clasp has nothing to do with anything. I just mentioned it in describing the pin is all. Should I merely have said, it has a pointy thing it the back that you stick through your clothing?
Sorry you feel we are acting like fools. You don't have to post to these if you don't want you, you know. We don't ask questions to bother the experts. We ask them to gain more knowledge. Thanks, anyway.
posted on February 27, 2003 03:03:18 PM new
Cheryl....don't let fluffy bother you, and don't expect an apology or anything close. fluff's just an old pita and normally one of those people inclined to disagree rather than agree.
.
.As for her expert opinion, I have some expertise in the field myself, and I believe that she's correct, but I'm not 100% sure. It's certainly worth sending to your brother before selling.
posted on February 27, 2003 03:07:52 PM new
Thanks, pointy. Like I said, I'm keeping it. It goes very well with some of the Scarab jewelry my brother has given me and that's the main reason I bought it. Now, that stuff IS old. Anyway, it's a great pin.
posted on February 28, 2003 12:45:40 PM new
I have always found that anyone who toots their own horn all the time does it because nobody else thinks it's worth tooting...is that right fluffy?
this forum is for all of us to chat and help each other as we can..
anyone who thinks they are such an expert that we are wasting their time may need to move on to an EXPERTS forum ...maybe...hmmmm.
posted on March 1, 2003 07:54:34 AM new
Cheryl,If that piece is real,It is
Art Nouveau,circa late 1800s to 1920s time frame.The main frame will be copper or silver to hold the enamel,and brass or gold plate finish.The stones would be faux Carnelian,and Rubies.This would have been the department store varity.
Also their were a lot made, by fine jewelry crafters useing solid gold with real stones.
If this is a repro.Its one of the best Ive seen in years,So much authenic detail to the back side which is unusual for a reproduction.See the pad the pin sits on?The round spot of soiter to the base,Ive never seen that part reproduced.
Then again,check it out,its worth something,Its very nice....
posted on March 1, 2003 08:19:38 AM new
junquemama
Thanks for the info. Could be gold, I'm not sure. I'm going to take it to my brother's shop to check it out. At any rate, it is a very well made piece in excellent condition. My mother has some very old pieces that look like they just came out of the jeweler's case. They were well taken care of. So, a piece does not have to look weathered to be old. I also acquired an (marked Germany)aluminum set with faux pearl and marcasite. Funny thing is, I found the matching bracelet on another website! Sad thing is, it's 10x more expensive than the necklace and earrings I was fortunate enough to buy for next to nothing. I'll let you know what I find out.
Cheryl
[ edited by CBlev65252 on Mar 1, 2003 08:22 AM ]
posted on March 1, 2003 11:53:23 AM new
Cheryl - I am a scarab fan also. I have many pieces mostly from the 50's. I think I have 5 scarab bracelets all different. Some GF and one just 50's costume. I like the 50's on the best. I have pins and also earrings. Scarabs just fasinate me but I don't know why. Keep us posted.
Scarabs are cool. Just got a necklace and told my brother to keep an eye out for a ring. I collect mostly 50's jewelry. Just love the look. It's funny. Back in the 70's I used to look through my mother's jewelry box and bauk at the 50's jewelry (Sarah Cov, Coro, Avon, etc.) in the box. How I wish I had those pieces today. She got rid of them in a garage sale long, long ago. Sigh.
posted on March 9, 2003 11:39:29 AM new
Update to the Brooch!
It is indeed real. Made in the mid to late 1920's! The scarab is Carnelian as I had thought. No information on the metal as it would have to be tested. John, my antique an jewelry expert said the pin is in marvelous condition with its original pinback. I had also picked up a cute little bar pin. Got it for$3. Cute enameled forget-me-knot flowers with what the seller thought was rhinestones in the center. Sure, some of the enameling is chipped. But, turns out the pin is mid-Victorian era, Gold and the rhinestones are actually rose cut diamonds. It amazes me how little research some of the sellers do. I can thank them for that. My collection is growing for very little money.
Thanks to everyone who offered their knowledge.
Cheryl
[ edited by CBlev65252 on Mar 9, 2003 11:46 AM ]
posted on March 9, 2003 07:42:26 PM new
There is a jewelry book titled "Old Jewelry" I think written by Lillian Baker, which I could be wrong about that. It is a paperback and it has a chapter on clasps. I have the book somewhere in this house. I have been looking and looking for it. You know how it is when you have an ebay room.
Well anyway the chapter goes through clasps from the beginning and it also goes into clasps that have a lock. You can tell what year your jewelry is by the clasp. That is if it hasn't been replaced.
Cheryl congratulations on your find.
