aladdinsgenie
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posted on June 7, 2003 04:55:32 PM new
Here's the story:
I sold a $12 item( book) to someone. They didn't purchase insurance(It was offered). I shipped it day after receiving payment(money order) They said they didn't get it. It has only been 3.5 weeks-for media mail this can happen. They have already given me a negative and filed a fraud report with E-Bay. They have 28, now 27 feedback rating while I have over 2,000. I have never run up against a buyer like this-what a waste of time. I know it would be easier to just give him his money back, but it irritates me that he just accused me right off of never sending his item. I am not going to start purchasing DC on every item I sell just because of this.
Does this guy have any recourse that he can use against me? or should I just ignore him from here on out?
Thanks.
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CBlev65252
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:07:51 PM new
I don't see what recourse they have. This wasn't a high price item. I can't see anyone trying to pull off a $12 scam. IMO they need to wait longer for their package. I've had some parcel posts take up to 4 weeks. What a rotten thing to do! I don't normally say this but - NEG HIM/HER!
Cheryl
My religion is simple, my religion is kindness.
--Dalai Llama
[ edited by CBlev65252 on Jun 7, 2003 05:08 PM ]
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hotcupoftea
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:09:08 PM new
If you are not a high volume seller, you should really use eDC on every package you ship out, since it is free for PM, and only thirteen cents for Media Mail and First Class. Make sure the window clerk scans the number into the USPS system, and that shows the package was mailed with date and time. By doing so, you are protecting yourself, plus it is required for Paypal paid transactions.
Your buyer isn't necessarily accusing you of fraud. You are unable to show proof of shipment, so your buyer is going through the necessary steps to get their money back.
I am not hotcupoftea on eBay.
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dadofstickboy
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:09:45 PM new
I've found book buyers are the worst of the lot.
Don't know why they buy books,they either can't read or they just don't understand anything they read!
I know they can't decipher simple TOS.
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neonmania
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:12:31 PM new
Hot - I think you misread their post - filing a fraud report with Ebay does nothing to get their money back - they are just accusing the seller of dishonesty.
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hotcupoftea
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:15:43 PM new
Another point to consider is that since your buyer paid with a money order, he can't do a charge back. The buyer can only hope to get his money back through the eBay system. As such, eBay has some pretty narrow time constraints on buyers making their claims. You might want the buyer to wait longer for the package to arrive, but the buyer has to protect himself by filing his claim in the time parameters imposed by eBay.
Just because your buyer has an id with a low feedback number doesn't mean the buyer doesn't have other ids with feedback ratings higher than yours.
I am not hotcupoftea on eBay.
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hotcupoftea
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:19:33 PM new
neonmania, I could be incorrect, but I believe eBay has a process for buyers to try to get money back. Part of the process requires the fraud report to be filed first. I went through this a few months ago for something I had purchased, but I was past the time deadline so could not file. I just remember that the fraud report was required in order to go to the next step.
I am not hotcupoftea on eBay.
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neonmania
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:49:41 PM new
Hot - they do but the deductable is more than the amount paid for the book so it would be of no use in this case.
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stopwhining
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posted on June 7, 2003 05:53:43 PM new
3.5 weeks sound too long even for media mail.
have you suggested to him to check with his post office or neighbor??
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Libra63
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posted on June 7, 2003 06:01:09 PM new
Do what hotcupoftea said. From now on use eDC on all of your packages. It is free for Priority Mail. 13 cents for 1st class, media mail etc. When you put the label on for 1st class, media mail etc you cut the priority part of the label off.
http://shiplabel.usps.com/cgi-bin/api/shipping_label.cgi?
13 cents is worth it for you will beable to see just where it is. Worth your time and trouble....
You can track it here....
http://trkcnfrm1.smi.usps.com/netdata-cgi/db2www/cbd_243.d2w/output
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fluffythewondercat
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posted on June 7, 2003 06:54:05 PM new
Disagree about 3.5 weeks being too long for Media Mail. Sold a cased two-volume set on Chinese furniture ($100), sent it Media Mail and it took 30 days to arrive. Buyer was chewing his fingernails the whole time but he knew it would come Media Mail so didn't really have any recourse.
--
California voters: Be a part of the first-ever successful gubernatorial recall! Defy media pundits! $21 million of our money is going down the tubes daily because of our incompetent corrupt governor. Visit http://www.recallgraydavis.com to download your recall petition.
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ahc3
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posted on June 7, 2003 08:03:32 PM new
I agree about media mail, I have had things show up a month later (and to Hawaii and Alaska it can be very slow too)
I also recommend using eDC for everything. It is really inexpensive (or free) and could protect you in the future. Amazingly, I've not had a problem since I went to this system. It never really was a problem before, but I would get the occasional package never arrived email.
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on June 7, 2003 08:19:23 PM new
3.5 weeks IS too short to wait for difficulties with delivery. The USPS will not start investigating lost packages unless 30 days has expired. Even if insurance has not been purchased a seller does have an opportunity to make the USPS search for the lost package. You can file a form 1510 (lost mail/rifling report) with your post office. This form requires both the sender and receivers signature. Once the form is completed, the post office conducts an investigation to find out what happened to the package. It should also show a good-faith effort that the sender DID ship the package and is also trying to assist the receiver. I'd recommend filing this report after the 30 days if the package hasn't been received yet. It can't do anything but help your case. I'm sorry you are having such an unreasonable buyer. I wish you luck in resolving the matter!
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LINDAJEAN
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posted on June 7, 2003 08:21:51 PM new
Say you mail 100 items a month. All of my items are media mail or first class.
.15 x 100 = $15.00
Lost item -- $12.00
That doesn't even start to include the cost of ink, paper, paste or tape and time in doing all the above.
That means I can refund one lost item per month (and that is a slow month) with the money I save NOT using DC.
I have never (knocking on wood) had an item lost in the mail or a buyer complain about waiting although a couple do get a little anxious on media. I am waaaaaay ahead of the game and since most of my items are under $20 I will continue to take my chances. I think most people here just get too upset about the possibility of giving a refund and spend lots more trying to prevent that possibility than they would in just paying it back.
Of course, anything over $30 I insure myself so I am only talking about small price items.
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ahc3
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posted on June 7, 2003 08:37:14 PM new
Actually, it is $13 per 100, and I tend to ship out 100 packages every few days. I still wouldn't go any other route at this point. It is media mail, and customers do write and ask where their item is (even though I never go more than 1 business day without shipping) and I can get them the current tracking information. It also is a LOT faster for me at the post office, as before they used to have to scan in every item (I use real stamps, so stamps.com or endica is not an answer) and now I just give them the packages and I am out of there in 3 minutes. To each their own, and if it is better to occasionally take a loss, I understand going that way too. For me, the benefit is more than having to give a $12 refund, it is being able to be a more professional seller, and it speeds up my time at the post office.
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Libra63
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posted on June 7, 2003 09:01:35 PM new
It's 13 cents for eDC and that can be added to your media mail or first class postage and not put a dent in the postage you charge your buyer. It will save you headaches as now I don't have to wonder if they got their package I know when and if they get it.
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sapington
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posted on June 7, 2003 09:23:01 PM new
Another reason to use e/DC is because it verifies that the address is real, adds the plus 4 zip code and the USPS system uses the barcode to help sort.
When I started using it the average delivery time for priority mail went from over 3 day down to about 2 days. (It rarely takes over 2 days anymore)
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fluffythewondercat
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posted on June 8, 2003 05:59:16 AM new
Lindajean: You must not have seen my posting where I shipped five items to the same buyer and she said she never received them. eDC shows they were delivered, though.
She gave me positive feedback on all five and is still buying from me. To this day she maintains she never received the five packages.
eDC was the difference between the result I just mentioned, and the usual unhappy buyer leaving neg/filing fraud report/opening Square Trade case/making life miserable with email, etc.
eDC. Worth it? Oh, yeah.
--
California voters: Be a part of the first-ever successful gubernatorial recall! Defy media pundits! $21 million of our money is going down the tubes daily because of our incompetent corrupt governor. Visit http://www.recallgraydavis.com to download your recall petition.
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clivebarkerfan
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posted on June 8, 2003 06:52:29 AM new
Ok, I'm feeling a tad stupid. I thought I had searched high and low on the USPS website for eDC for 1st class mail, but can't seem to find it. Can someone point me in the right direction? (who said men can't stop and ask for directions?!  )
[ edited by clivebarkerfan on Jun 8, 2003 06:52 AM ]
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stopwhining
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posted on June 8, 2003 08:47:47 AM new
go back and read the prior postings- i believe they said print the usps priority label and cut off the priority part,and pay 13 cents??
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stopwhining
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posted on June 8, 2003 08:50:28 AM new
i have a slow printer,it is just not worth my while to print the label,besides it uses a lot of ink??
no??yes??
whether it is e-dc or plain dc,it does not prove it has been delivered to the buyer,it just shows it has arrived at destination post office.
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fluffythewondercat
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posted on June 8, 2003 10:14:03 AM new
(patiently) Yes, stopwhining, WE ALL KNOW THAT.
Now, sit down and listen for a change.
I gave the eDC numbers to the customer, she looked them up herself and saw that all the packages were delivered. (Did I say..anywhere..it showed the packages delivered TO HER?)
What convinced her was that it was the Postal Service telling her this, not a fly-by-night eBay seller.
That is what you are buying with eDC. Legitimacy. At least in this case.
--
California voters: Be a part of the first-ever successful gubernatorial recall! Defy media pundits! $21 million of our money is going down the tubes daily because of our incompetent corrupt governor. Visit http://www.recallgraydavis.com to download your recall petition.
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paloma91
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posted on June 8, 2003 10:21:53 AM new
I always use USPS's DC and have never had any problems. I am NOT a high volume seller. I tell ya' it has saved my butt on more than one occasion!
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clivebarkerfan
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posted on June 8, 2003 06:21:23 PM new
stopwhining - Thanks, I must've just missed that part!
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Libra63
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posted on June 8, 2003 06:45:49 PM new
stopwhining. Set your printer to ecnofast and it will still give enough ink to print the label.
Click the file, then click on print. Your printer name should be there and next to it it should say properties. Click that and you will get setup and you can see where you can change your printer ink to ecnofast. This should save you quite a bit. On medium I could print one rheme of paper with this it is more than two. Saves a lot of money.
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sanmar
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posted on June 9, 2003 10:29:40 AM new
I hope you kept the USPS receipt for this. It will show the date shipped & where it was
mailed to & the cost of shipping. If you have that, then you can prove that you committed no fraud.I just pulled one of mine & it shows the city, state & zip code & $amount of postage. The date & time of the transaction are also on it. It also shows the type action, i.e. Priority Mail, Media mail etc,
[ edited by sanmar on Jun 9, 2003 10:31 AM ]
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stopwhining
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posted on June 9, 2003 10:51:39 AM new
first,i set the print to print fast,so we shall see.
second,back to e-dc or plain dc,i have a case right now that the dc shows it has ARRIVED at buyer post office,but the buyer did not receive it.
so she is now doing a PHD in tracking this package,it went to atlanta and god knows what happens ??
if your buyer lives in an apt complex and these packages were left with the front office or doorman,yes,they were delivered to the address,but not to that apt if the buyer is not home,or they dont fit into her mailbox or postman has the practice of leaving them with the doorman or front office.
DC is good enough for paypal seller protection,but not good enough for credit card chargeback,try telling the buyer credit card issuer that DC shows it has arrived at the post office??
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msincognito
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posted on June 9, 2003 10:51:59 AM new
aladdinsgenie in terms of your response .... I have one suggestion ....
Even though it might be good to leave a really scathing neg, I'd wait until the transaction is 100 percent complete - either your bidder receieved the package or it's just been too long - and then leave a factual, un-emotional negative or whatever feedback is deserved.
In the meantime, respond to their negative with a VERY unemotional explanation(Example: "Book shipped day after payment, no insurance, sorry." )
The reason is this: If the book arrives, the bidder will see the postmark date and realize you were being truthful all along. At that point, they may agree to join with you and petition eBay to get the negative removed. That probably won't work .... but in the meantime, you MAY be able to convince them to respond to YOUR response in your own feedback profile with a statement that the negative was left in error. That way, bidders who actually check your negs out will immediately see that it wasn't really your fault.
If you neg them now the chances of getting their cooperation later (or even hearing from them if the book arrives) are probably nil.
Good luck!
[ edited by msincognito on Jun 9, 2003 10:53 AM ]
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Libra63
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posted on June 9, 2003 11:07:29 AM new
[B]if your buyer lives in an apt complex and these packages were left with the front office or doorman,yes,they were delivered to the address,but not to that apt if the buyer is not home,or they dont fit into her mailbox or postman has the practice of leaving them with the doorman or front office[B].
I beg to differ with this statement..The only way the postman can leave that package like that is if the seller has given him permission...If they are not at home that postman must leave a slip to the effect that he tried to deliver a package and addressee was not home so the package was returned to the postoffice. If the addressee does not go to that post office to accept it they will try one more time to deliver it.I know because this happened to a buyer of mine. It showed delivered and she never got it. Well come to find out she gave that postman authority to leave the package even she isn't home. She is out of luck the USPS says it was delivered. They have the proof. Seller is out even if they have insurance. The postmasters cannot file a insurance claim if the eDC says it was delivered...
[ edited by Libra63 on Jun 9, 2003 11:09 AM ]
[ edited by Libra63 on Jun 9, 2003 11:10 AM ]
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sapington
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posted on June 9, 2003 11:14:03 AM new
Why would anyone use an ink printer? A cheap laser printer is much better and much cheaper to feed.
I wouldn't even consider using an ink printer unless I only printed 1 or 2 pages per month.
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