posted on June 7, 2001 03:49:20 PM new
Court Rejects McVeigh Delay Request
.c The Associated Press
DENVER (June 7) - A federal appeals court on Thursday rejected Timothy McVeigh's request to delay his execution Monday for the Oklahoma City bombing.
''McVeigh has utterly failed to demonstrate substantial grounds upon which relief might be granted,'' the court decision said.
McVeigh is set to die by injection Monday at the federal prison in Terre Haute, Ind.
A three-judge panel from the 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals considered McVeigh's argument much of Thursday and issued its ruling without hearing oral arguments.
Earlier Thursday, McVeigh attorney Nathan Chambers declined to say whether the legal team would appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court if it lost in the appeals court.
McVeigh's lawyers wanted more time to review nearly 4,500 pages of belatedly released FBI documents for information they felt could have helped in his defense during the 1997 trial.
The lawyers argued that U.S. District Judge Richard Matsch was caught up in the horror of the Oklahoma City bombing and ''lost sight of the demands of fairness.''
Matsch denied the initial appeal Wednesday.
AP-NY-06-07-01 1825EDT
Comforting, isn't it?
Also this week, the Justice Dept decided that federal executions, which had been halted because of claims of racial inequalities within the system, could proceed. Yeah, we all know that the system is fair and square. Uh huh. Heaven forbid we err on the side of caution; that would just be too sensible.
posted on June 7, 2001 04:34:37 PM new
What defense? He confessed. He gave an in-depth interview, and only regretted that dead babies detracted from his message.
He Slaughtered. Murdered. Destroyed. Maimed. Purposefully. And Confessed. Gloried in it.
What I saw on TV were the most horrible and horrifying things I've ever seen, or ever dread to see as long as I live.
Maybe there was a larger conspiracy than just the two that were caught. If the "discovered documents" identify them, great. We handle that unlikely issue should it pan out. It's not like he was planning to tell anyone, and I don't believe that any other conspirators exist. I don't think the investigators believe there are any other conspirators exist.
There is no chance that he didn't do it. None. And no reason to delay this mass murderer's execution. None.
If he had ruthlessly butchered my baby, I'd kill him myself.
He will die more gently and peacefully than any of his victims did. And they won't have to sew his pieces back on and try to cover the gaping flesh and bloody damage with funeral make-up so his family can see him one last time.
And don't bother quoting scripture at me, I have all that on ignore.
posted on June 7, 2001 04:34:38 PM new
According to the News on one of the major chanels today McVeigh once again has told his lawyers, no more appeals...he's ready for martyrdom!
posted on June 7, 2001 05:09:13 PM new
He didn't confess at his trial, or while under oath. He admitted (bragged about) his guilt after being convicted. At his trial, the procescution neglected to turn over approx 4,000 documents to his defense team. Fair trial? I don't think so. Here is a defendant on trial...a case under so much scrutiny, and he didn't receive due process. What happens to all those defendants whose trials aren't under scrutiny? Yeah, we all know what happens to those defendants.
Save the dramatics, Victoria; I'm not here to defend his deeds.
Some folks might be willing to trade their constitutional rights on and off, depending on what suits them, but I'm not.
I am fed up with a broken system that kills people in my name. It's that simple.
posted on June 7, 2001 05:15:52 PM new
There was a time when I was for the death penalty, but could not in good conscience support that belief any longer once DNA testing became available.
Because of the availability of DNA testing now, just look how many have been found innocent of the crimes for which they were imprisoned. I don't like to think about how many innocent people were accused, found guilty and sent to their deaths before DNA testing.
Therefore, I cannot sway from my stance even for someone who committed such an unspeakable crime as the one committed by Timothy McVeigh.
Even if I were pro death penalty, I would still rather see McVeigh in a prison, NOT FEDERAL, with other murderers. Let come what may (remember Jeffrey Dahmer?).
If the execution does take place on Monday, June 11, who will feel safe in a federal building come June 11, 2002? The world is full of martyr wannabes.
posted on June 7, 2001 05:22:28 PM new
I don't think you could pick a worse candidate as a poster boy to argue against the death penalty. If anything he could be the poster boy to argue for an agonizing death penalty.
posted on June 7, 2001 06:00:39 PM new
I agree with you, uaru, to a certain extent. But, part of what makes him "the" poster boy is that he is such a notorious defendant. Without that notoriety, would we even be paying any attention to the subject of capital punishment?
posted on June 7, 2001 06:12:51 PM new
How people can revel, celebrate, and fantasize about tortuous death for another human being is beyond me. Kinda puts one on the same level as McVeigh, eh?
My heart hurts for the victim's families and friends who will find that this man's death will not bring their loved ones back to life. They will remain dead. There is no relief for the pain they have, and killing McVeigh won't bring them the closure they seek.
posted on June 7, 2001 06:18:56 PM new
I agree the subject is about much more than this one person and case. It is true if we abandon the protections for one all are at risk.
Reminds me of a tomestone I saw out west when I was a boy. I don't remember the name but it said "hung by mistake" Our officials are not that honest today.
posted on June 7, 2001 06:25:12 PM new
Katyd, I know you dont agree with the death penalty, and most people, if confronted with actually pulling a switch or injecting the drug, would probably hesitate because it IS condeming someone to death..final breath sort of thing and the person doing it may be no better. However, thinking of those babies and what Timothy did, I find no pity or empathy in me to extend to him.
Here's a question to think on. IF you (general *you*) could shoot and kill Hitler, would you? He isnt dead. He is awaiting trial. Jail is not guarded. Gun is laying next to cell door. Who would pick up that gun and send him to hell? I would.
posted on June 7, 2001 06:31:51 PM new
No. Yes. No. Yes. Why not kill him katyd? (hitler). Lets put it another way. What if someone hurt/killed your children? Blew them up. Tortured them over and over again before killing them. Then bragged about it. You wouldnt want him dead if face to face?
posted on June 7, 2001 06:35:46 PM new
If someone hurt my children, there is no doubt I would feel that way, hepburn. But no amount of killing or torturing or cutting to pieces or blowing up the person who did it would bring my children back to me. And that is why I would hurt just as much after that person was dead, as when he was alive. Probably more.
posted on June 7, 2001 06:42:14 PM new
No, it wont bring them back, but it sure will bring satisfaction to give back to the one torturing a taste of the fear, pain and absolute despair and aloneness suffered by the perpetrator, wouldnt it? As in Hitler, to see your mother, father, children, relatives, friends all hauled off to be experimented on at HIS orders by goons who have no soul. McVeigh killed many. Hitler killed millions. No, it wont bring all those people back. But who can blame the ones who agonized knowing their loved ones screamed with pain while both those monsters "got off" on it to want vengeance?
posted on June 7, 2001 06:58:21 PM new
I honestly don't think that it would bring any "satisfaction" to any victim's loved one. If anything, it would bring even more nightmares.
It's not that I don't "believe" in the death penalty. It's the law and that's that. I personally couldn't sentence someone to death. But that's me. I don't think it is "justice", it is "revenge" and I don't believe it accomplishes anything. It won't bring those dead people back. And it's not going to erase the pain of their survivors. But what I find most distasteful is the circus atmosphere surrounding this "execution". Like it's a celebration, a party. It's not. He is someone's child too. There are people who will mourn him. They will hurt too. He is a human being.
posted on June 7, 2001 07:01:18 PM new
Like KatyD, I am against the death penalty. Besides the moral issue is the possibility that you would be killing an innocent individual. Why take this chance. Doesn't it seem barbaric to you, only to extract some kind of vengence?
posted on June 7, 2001 07:09:43 PM new
I oppose the death penalty under any circumstance because there can be no repentance or salvation after death.
Where there is life, there is hope.
T
posted on June 7, 2001 07:11:26 PM new
Helen, it's not that I am "against" the death penalty. I honestly don't know if I am or not. No doubt there are people who through their actions, have lost their right to live among civilized society. That said, I don't believe the death penalty is applied evenly and fairly to all classes. I will be interested in seeing if these embassy bombing terrorists recently convicted in New York will receive the death penalty. The "word" is that they won't because of the "international repercussions" it would cause. In which case it would prove that the death penalty is not applied evenly at all. A domestic terrorist gets it, but foreign ones do not.
Regardless, the hooplah and salivating anticipation of McVeigh's execution disgusts me.
posted on June 7, 2001 07:13:52 PM new
Different strokes for different folks. No, it isnt barbaric to me to extract vengeance for something as horrific as what applies to those two individuals I named. Yes, McVeigh is someones elses child. Yes, they will feel pain when hes executed. Just like hundreds of others felt pain when their loved ones met their death at his hands. If it happened to me or mine, I would want very much to be present, and sell popcorn. Sorry if that is crass, but its how I feel. I am not belittling what you think or feel katyd. I understand your end of it. But this is MY end. No compassion do I have for McVeigh. Nor what his loved ones may feel when he does die.
posted on June 7, 2001 07:17:15 PM newNor what his loved ones may feel when he does die.
Well, I don't know you very well, hepburn, but from what I've seen of you, I don't believe that statement at all. I choose to believe that you do have compassion.
posted on June 7, 2001 07:19:47 PM new
What about the innocent next victim? If Ted Bundy would have been put to death before he was there would be several innocent girls still alive.
I saw on Americas most wanted the story of a little girl about 11 I think. She was sleeping over at a friends house when a man climbed in the window, killed her best friend right in front of her and then slit her throat leaving her for dead. Gratefully she survived and testified at his trial. He has since been linked to several murders. The death penalty for him would accomplish two things
1) prevent him from killing again
2) Let this little girl not live in constant fear of him getting out of jail and coming after her.
